NPR

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Fri Dec 30, 2022 2:43 pm

Kawazaki wrote: ↑Fri Dec 30, 2022 2:26 pm

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Fri Dec 30, 2022 12:18 pm Rugby was an evasion sport that's become a collision sport. While I'd allow that it's always required physicality, I wouln't accept that it is a sport of violence, controlled or otherwise.

I'm not sure how old you are but that summary is absolute bollocks. Forwards use far more evasion and footwork now than they ever did when I played.

Rugby should change it's characterisation as a sport - it should be bracketed with boxing and MMA. It would do wonders for the growth of the game if they did this instead of the beta soy latte version of rugby the RFU wants it to be.

Christ.

Accepting rugby will be a bloodsport may well be viable at a pro level but it is the end of the club game. Middle class parents don't take their kids to boxing clubs

They wouldn't be taking them to boxing clubs.

Kawazaki wrote: ↑Fri Dec 30, 2022 2:26 pm

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Fri Dec 30, 2022 12:18 pm Rugby was an evasion sport that's become a collision sport. While I'd allow that it's always required physicality, I wouln't accept that it is a sport of violence, controlled or otherwise.

I'm not sure how old you are but that summary is absolute bollocks. Forwards use far more evasion and footwork now than they ever did when I played.

Rugby should change it's characterisation as a sport - it should be bracketed with boxing and MMA. It would do wonders for the growth of the game if they did this instead of the beta soy latte version of rugby the RFU wants it to be.

Countering bollocks with bollocks then. Forwards being able to throw in a sidestep or spin in the tackle doesn't make the game now more evasive than it once was.

Even in turn of the millenium footage, let alone pre-professionalism, it's really noticeable how much more space there is for players to run and that changes player option taking. Now, the further back you go the more the game turns into an endless procession of set pieces, but when the ball is in open play there's a lot more space that doesn't require manufacturing through pure brute force and putting others into space rather than running into brick walls wasn't the norm.

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Fri Dec 30, 2022 3:33 pm

Kawazaki wrote: ↑Fri Dec 30, 2022 2:26 pm

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Fri Dec 30, 2022 12:18 pm Rugby was an evasion sport that's become a collision sport. While I'd allow that it's always required physicality, I wouln't accept that it is a sport of violence, controlled or otherwise.

I'm not sure how old you are but that summary is absolute bollocks. Forwards use far more evasion and footwork now than they ever did when I played.

Rugby should change it's characterisation as a sport - it should be bracketed with boxing and MMA. It would do wonders for the growth of the game if they did this instead of the beta soy latte version of rugby the RFU wants it to be.

Countering bollocks with bollocks then. Forwards being able to throw in a sidestep or spin in the tackle doesn't make the game now more evasive than it once was.

Even in turn of the millenium footage, let alone pre-professionalism, it's really noticeable how much more space there is for players to run and that changes player option taking. Now, the further back you go the more the game turns into an endless procession of set pieces, but when the ball is in open play there's a lot more space that doesn't require manufacturing through pure brute force and putting others into space rather than running into brick walls wasn't the norm.

It's almost like teams started employing defence coaches.

Well, yes. And the size and athleticism of players increased to go alongside that. I wasn't endavouring to explain the transition from evasion to collision, merely note that the focus of the game was different in past.

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Fri Dec 30, 2022 5:23 pm Well, yes. And the size and athleticism of players increased to go alongside that. I wasn't endavouring to explain the transition from evasion to collision, merely note that the focus of the game was different in past.

Players run patterns to expose soft shoulders. I can assure you that finding space is very much the ultimate objective.

Any suggestions on ways to get around Virgin Media Player’s geoblocking? I’m in the Channel Islands so hadn’t anticipated any issues

Well that was a pleasant end to 2022, not often you put forty on Tiggers

Brazil wrote: ↑Fri Dec 30, 2022 9:37 pm Well that was a pleasant end to 2022, not often you put forty on Tiggers

I had that as a tight win

EnergiseR2 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 30, 2022 5:37 pm

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Fri Dec 30, 2022 2:17 pm Marler is one of a number of players who seems chronically addicted to trying to be the Archbishop of Banterbury

He's harmless. As for wanting more from him than an apology...Well its the total emasculation of society. Telling some lad you rode his ma or she is a whore is just the way. It's so normal it's not even particularly shocking or funny. It just is. He didn't know Heenans mother was in hospital and if Heenan is moaning about it he needs to cop on

Stick to GBNews

EnergiseR2 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 30, 2022 11:49 pm Bollox. I am Irish but its boring as fuck this Marler witch hunt. POM shites on and every online post from nurugby fans fawns over him and giggle away at how hardy, humourous and smart he is. Marler says something stupid and he is savaged.

maybe the Irish think so about the Munster jerk.

Both of them are scumbags

EnergiseR2 wrote: ↑Sat Dec 31, 2022 8:35 am

Monk wrote: ↑Sat Dec 31, 2022 7:09 am

EnergiseR2 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 30, 2022 11:49 pm Bollox. I am Irish but its boring as fuck this Marler witch hunt. POM shites on and every online post from nurugby fans fawns over him and giggle away at how hardy, humourous and smart he is. Marler says something stupid and he is savaged.

maybe the Irish think so about the Munster jerk.

Both of them are scumbags

Loads of the top players sledge. Itoje has sledged to multiple wins over Ireland and Leinster. The Van der Flier types are probably rarer

I think it is primarily a UK and Ireland thing

The only SH player I see acting like this is Dane Coles - who is mentally retarded

Brazil wrote: ↑Fri Dec 30, 2022 9:37 pm Well that was a pleasant end to 2022, not often you put forty on Tiggers

Sale well worth the win and scoreline. Outmuscled and bullied Tigers.
To be fair to Tigers they did suffer a series of injuries during the match and ended with their reserve hooker Oghre playing 20 minutes at centre!!!

EnergiseR2 wrote: ↑Sat Dec 31, 2022 8:35 am

Monk wrote: ↑Sat Dec 31, 2022 7:09 am

EnergiseR2 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 30, 2022 11:49 pm Bollox. I am Irish but its boring as fuck this Marler witch hunt. POM shites on and every online post from nurugby fans fawns over him and giggle away at how hardy, humourous and smart he is. Marler says something stupid and he is savaged.

maybe the Irish think so about the Munster jerk.

Both of them are scumbags

Loads of the top players sledge. Itoje has sledged to multiple wins over Ireland and Leinster. The Van der Flier types are probably rarer

What did he say?

EnergiseR2 wrote: ↑Sat Dec 31, 2022 10:14 am Mean things about James Ryan's baby face. Awful things

I thought he would have just whooped and hollered in his ear

EnergiseR2 wrote: ↑Sat Dec 31, 2022 10:14 am Mean things about James Ryan's baby face. Awful things

Within reason, personal sledges are fine. Asking a prop if his back is ok before the first lineout as he's about to try and lift a very heavy lock etc.

Got to say I'm not comfortable with Marler's ban. I think he tries to hard with the 'banter' side as he tries to build his bro-ish brand for retirement, but in the end it was a comment, he clearly had no idea about the bloke's circumstances and I'm pretty sceptical of 'rugby values' as a concept full stop. A sport at ease with itself would have sorted this with a proper face to face apology.

SaintK wrote: ↑Sat Dec 31, 2022 9:15 am

Brazil wrote: ↑Fri Dec 30, 2022 9:37 pm Well that was a pleasant end to 2022, not often you put forty on Tiggers

Sale well worth the win and scoreline. Outmuscled and bullied Tigers.
To be fair to Tigers they did suffer a series of injuries during the match and ended with their reserve hooker Oghre playing 20 minutes at centre!!!

Yeah, they were on the bones of their arses by the end, though I'd guess that the way sale absorbed all the pressure in the first 20 and then stepped the physicality up another notch is what did for them. What was pleasing is how well we ran the ball, and in particular Sam James play in putting players into space. Considering we've still got our first choice half backs to come back from injury it's very promising.

SaintK wrote: ↑Sat Dec 31, 2022 9:15 am

Brazil wrote: ↑Fri Dec 30, 2022 9:37 pm Well that was a pleasant end to 2022, not often you put forty on Tiggers

Sale well worth the win and scoreline. Outmuscled and bullied Tigers.
To be fair to Tigers they did suffer a series of injuries during the match and ended with their reserve hooker Oghre playing 20 minutes at centre!!!

Tigers were stupid at the beginning of the game to keep going for a try instead of just kicking the points. Pollards played twice for Tigers and both games we've been hammered.

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Sat Dec 31, 2022 12:36 pm Got to say I'm not comfortable with Marler's ban. I think he tries to hard with the 'banter' side as he tries to build his bro-ish brand for retirement, but in the end it was a comment, he clearly had no idea about the bloke's circumstances and I'm pretty sceptical of 'rugby values' as a concept full stop. A sport at ease with itself would have sorted this with a proper face to face apology.

If it was anyone else on a first offence I'd agree but Marler does this all the time. Rugby isn't a vehicle for him to sell Marler. He's a recidivist twat and needs banning for repeating offences and ignoring previous warnings.

Kawazaki wrote: ↑Sat Dec 31, 2022 1:52 pm

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Sat Dec 31, 2022 12:36 pm Got to say I'm not comfortable with Marler's ban. I think he tries to hard with the 'banter' side as he tries to build his bro-ish brand for retirement, but in the end it was a comment, he clearly had no idea about the bloke's circumstances and I'm pretty sceptical of 'rugby values' as a concept full stop. A sport at ease with itself would have sorted this with a proper face to face apology.

If it was anyone else on a first offence I'd agree but Marler does this all the time. Rugby isn't a vehicle for him to sell Marler. He's a recidivist twat and needs banning for repeating offences and ignoring previous warnings.

Agreed completely.

Marler is a high profile player - can’t have him turn club fixtures into his personal cabaret

Actually surprised that his club has not spoken to him before about his eccentricities.

Bath penalised for 16 on the pitch. Don't see that too often.

Bath hold out for a win at long last.

Exeter absolutely dominated by Saracens in horrible conditions. Can't think of a single facet where Sarries weren't on top.

inactionman wrote: ↑Sat Dec 31, 2022 4:50 pm Bath penalised for 16 on the pitch. Don't see that too often.

Bath hold out for a win at long last.

Yeah, real collector's item. How did it come about, someone miss that they were being subbed off?

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Sat Dec 31, 2022 4:57 pm

inactionman wrote: ↑Sat Dec 31, 2022 4:50 pm Bath penalised for 16 on the pitch. Don't see that too often.

Bath hold out for a win at long last.

Yeah, real collector's item. How did it come about, someone miss that they were being subbed off?

Quite a few changes made just before Newcastle restarted, with only a few minutes left and 8 points down. Not sure who was supposed to come off but didn't, there were changes in front row and centres and god knows where else - I certainly lost track. Also, Reid was down with a bad knock (looked like a stinger?) so it might have been him supposed to been coming off - I couldn't see if he left the pitch or not.

They played a good few phases before noticing, I think the penalty was given at the point the ball was once the ref noticed it. I had no idea that was how it worked.

Very dominant bonus boint win by Sarries against Chiefs
PLayed very smart in the conditions and won the collisions and the set pieces.
Chiefs had a few out with injuries but were well beaten front and back
Discipline and penalty count killed them.

That was an absolute pasting, Faz a different animal in a Sarries shirt

Is young Dafydd injured?

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Sat Dec 31, 2022 5:05 pm That was an absolute pasting, Faz a different animal in a Sarries shirt

Judging by the commentary team and the papers he's nailed on to lead England into the world cup from 10. Would be good to see if he could produce the same form.

Exeter need a full refresh.

JM2K6 wrote: ↑Sat Dec 31, 2022 11:36 pm

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Sat Dec 31, 2022 5:05 pm That was an absolute pasting, Faz a different animal in a Sarries shirt

Judging by the commentary team and the papers he's nailed on to lead England into the world cup from 10. Would be good to see if he could produce the same form.

Would prefer it if Borthwick made someone else captain.

petej wrote: ↑Sun Jan 01, 2023 12:21 pm

JM2K6 wrote: ↑Sat Dec 31, 2022 11:36 pm

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Sat Dec 31, 2022 5:05 pm That was an absolute pasting, Faz a different animal in a Sarries shirt

Judging by the commentary team and the papers he's nailed on to lead England into the world cup from 10. Would be good to see if he could produce the same form.

Would prefer it if Borthwick made someone else captain.

Yep, agree. Though nobody readily springs to mind that's definitely going to get picked.

SaintK wrote: ↑Sun Jan 01, 2023 12:56 pm

petej wrote: ↑Sun Jan 01, 2023 12:21 pm

JM2K6 wrote: ↑Sat Dec 31, 2022 11:36 pm

Judging by the commentary team and the papers he's nailed on to lead England into the world cup from 10. Would be good to see if he could produce the same form.

Would prefer it if Borthwick made someone else captain.

Yep, agree. Though nobody readily springs to mind that's definitely going to get picked.

Can't see him being bold enough to go with Genge again.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/rugby-union ... borthwick/

Dan Cole, Dan Kelly and Ben Earl reportedly being included in a wider squad that will be announced in next couple days.

JM2K6 wrote: ↑Sat Dec 31, 2022 11:36 pm

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Sat Dec 31, 2022 5:05 pm That was an absolute pasting, Faz a different animal in a Sarries shirt

Judging by the commentary team and the papers he's nailed on to lead England into the world cup from 10. Would be good to see if he could produce the same form.

Farrell is a much more effective player at 10 rather than 12. He does operate much better with a second playmaker at 15 though. And that isn't Steward*.



* In the latest Ruck podcast, they were doing their XV of the year and whilst discussing the fullback options, they read out some opta stats. Steward had the worst tackle completion rate by miles compared to the other options, including Ramos. Wait for it...


... Steward only completed 55% of the tackles he attempted in test rugby in 2022.

Kawazaki wrote: ↑Sun Jan 01, 2023 2:06 pm

JM2K6 wrote: ↑Sat Dec 31, 2022 11:36 pm

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Sat Dec 31, 2022 5:05 pm That was an absolute pasting, Faz a different animal in a Sarries shirt

Judging by the commentary team and the papers he's nailed on to lead England into the world cup from 10. Would be good to see if he could produce the same form.

Farrell is a much more effective player at 10 rather than 12. He does operate much better with a second playmaker at 15 though. And that isn't Steward*.



* In the latest Ruck podcast, they were doing their XV of the year and whilst discussing the fullback options, they read out some opta stats. Steward had the worst tackle completion rate by miles compared to the other options, including Ramos. Wait for it...


... Steward only completed 55% of the tackles he attempted in test rugby in 2022.

It's undeniable that Farrell has been a much more effective player at 12 for England. His times at 10 have been patchy, and there's a gulf in the success rates for England when Ford plays 10 vs Farrell playing there.

He is, no doubt, a fantastic 10 for Saracens. He has the ability and can certainly execute a number of game plans that could see success with England. Which makes it all the more mysterious that over several years there's been such a gulf between what he can do at Saracens and what he can do with England (or the Lions, tbh). We've seen glimpses of it for England and he is such an experienced player in such great club form that there can be no excuses if he doesn't step up if, as is seeming very likely, he is given the shirt by a coach who thinks very highly of him.

Interesting stats re: Steward though I would want to dig into them a little more. He is very very young though, so I'm happy to let him develop in the role given he's head and shoulders above the next best option.

Also, calling up Dan Cole is a pisstake.

geordie_6 wrote: ↑Sun Jan 01, 2023 2:04 pm https://www.telegraph.co.uk/rugby-union ... borthwick/

Dan Cole, Dan Kelly and Ben Earl reportedly being included in a wider squad that will be announced in next couple days.

Hmmm not sure about Cole coming back. The other two are fine
Interesting that it usually The Mail that get the squad leaks
Evidently Proudfoot has been released from his contract as scrum coach

Not sure Cole is the answer but our scrum has been underwhelming and the Prem doesn't strike me as being flush with options

Cole is very slow, not the player he was, and still a liability.

Should be an easy win for Saints here, Quins with a bit of a shadow team and are now down to the dregs in a few positions. Another injury to start a game too