The Official English Rugby Thread

[ASMO]

Word on the street is that England planning on replacing Owen "no arms" Farrell

[Paddington Bear]

Following on from Saturday, have to say I feel something of a tit for absolutely kicking off at having to go to a wedding on the World Cup semi finals weekend

[fishfoodie]

Word on the street is that England planning on replacing Owen "no arms" Farrell

It hardly matters when you're now going to be starting Ben "The Sloth" Youngs !

[Rhubarb & Custard]

And yet Youngs was fine again at the weekend, or at least whilst we had a lot of problems he wasn't much of one. He sometimes is a problem, but it does get overlooked he's hardly all bad, and it gets overlooked some of his seeming problems are from what's happening (or not happening) around him

[SaintK]

Word on the street is that England planning on replacing Owen "no arms" Farrell

You been talking to Jake?

[fishfoodie]

And yet Youngs was fine again at the weekend, or at least whilst we had a lot of problems he wasn't much of one. He sometimes is a problem, but it does get overlooked he's hardly all bad, and it gets overlooked some of his seeming problems are from what's happening (or not happening) around him

He was only, "fine", in the context of one of the worst games of Rugby any of us had ever seen, where you'd need an electron microscope to find the ambition of either side. So sure, if you play on your wingers never getting the ball, & booting it away at every opportunity, he's "fine"

[Paddington Bear]

And yet Youngs was fine again at the weekend, or at least whilst we had a lot of problems he wasn't much of one. He sometimes is a problem, but it does get overlooked he's hardly all bad, and it gets overlooked some of his seeming problems are from what's happening (or not happening) around him

He was only, "fine", in the context of one of the worst games of Rugby any of us had ever seen, where you'd need an electron microscope to find the ambition of either side. So sure, if you play on your wingers never getting the ball, & booting it away at every opportunity, he's "fine"

I'm sorry when we talk 'worst games of rugby we've ever seen', which happens a lot with England games nowadays, are we all supposed to have some sort of collective amnesia for much of the early 2000s outside the top 4 teams?

[fishfoodie]

And yet Youngs was fine again at the weekend, or at least whilst we had a lot of problems he wasn't much of one. He sometimes is a problem, but it does get overlooked he's hardly all bad, and it gets overlooked some of his seeming problems are from what's happening (or not happening) around him

He was only, "fine", in the context of one of the worst games of Rugby any of us had ever seen, where you'd need an electron microscope to find the ambition of either side. So sure, if you play on your wingers never getting the ball, & booting it away at every opportunity, he's "fine"

I'm sorry when we talk 'worst games of rugby we've ever seen', which happens a lot with England games nowadays, are we all supposed to have some sort of collective amnesia for much of the early 2000s outside the top 4 teams?

Fair point, we've been a bit spoiled in recent years & if fifty point haven't been scored, feel a bit ripped off.

[Slick]

And yet Youngs was fine again at the weekend, or at least whilst we had a lot of problems he wasn't much of one. He sometimes is a problem, but it does get overlooked he's hardly all bad, and it gets overlooked some of his seeming problems are from what's happening (or not happening) around him

He was only, "fine", in the context of one of the worst games of Rugby any of us had ever seen, where you'd need an electron microscope to find the ambition of either side. So sure, if you play on your wingers never getting the ball, & booting it away at every opportunity, he's "fine"

I'm sorry when we talk 'worst games of rugby we've ever seen', which happens a lot with England games nowadays, are we all supposed to have some sort of collective amnesia for much of the early 2000s outside the top 4 teams?

It's a good point, and one a Scotsman can wholeheartedly get on board with. In saying that, the last 3 England v Wales matches have to be in my top 5 or 6 worst rugby watching experiences.

[inactionman]

England vs Wales are always drudgery in rugby terms, particularly in Gatland era, but they tend to have the saving grace that they're usually a bit nip and tuck in terms of result. That was the only thing last saturday's match had going for it.

[Paddington Bear]

He was only, "fine", in the context of one of the worst games of Rugby any of us had ever seen, where you'd need an electron microscope to find the ambition of either side. So sure, if you play on your wingers never getting the ball, & booting it away at every opportunity, he's "fine"

I'm sorry when we talk 'worst games of rugby we've ever seen', which happens a lot with England games nowadays, are we all supposed to have some sort of collective amnesia for much of the early 2000s outside the top 4 teams?

It's a good point, and one a Scotsman can wholeheartedly get on board with. In saying that, the last 3 England v Wales matches have to be in my top 5 or 6 worst rugby watching experiences.

Yeah I'm not saying the last two weeks have been edge of the seat stuff but we really need some perspective. The 6N game was an absolute bog standard 6N match that could have taken place between any of the sides at any of their low points since 2000 (or Italy during their big pack years), the reaction to it was wildly out of kilter with that reality. Neither side is a hit with the neutral, admittedly, which likely exacerbates things.

[Rhubarb & Custard]

And yet Youngs was fine again at the weekend, or at least whilst we had a lot of problems he wasn't much of one. He sometimes is a problem, but it does get overlooked he's hardly all bad, and it gets overlooked some of his seeming problems are from what's happening (or not happening) around him

He was only, "fine", in the context of one of the worst games of Rugby any of us had ever seen, where you'd need an electron microscope to find the ambition of either side. So sure, if you play on your wingers never getting the ball, & booting it away at every opportunity, he's "fine"

I'm not arguing it was the 2nd coming of an attacking George Gregan having a good day. In the context of what he was asked to do he was fine.

The gripes, you could probably argue some of the 2 second rucks could've been closer to 1.5 seconds and he's part of that slowing the play, but his sense might be no one is really demanding the ball outside so if he lifts tempo he's only going to see the error rate go up. Not out and out awful slowing, but yes it could have been quicker, and it wasn't him being bad going into contact and not presenting good ball starting the problem. There was the scrum penalty Wales won when the scrum skewed around, he was relieved of the ball a little too easily and Wales might have been able to tap and go if they were at the mark, basically he could (and should) have cheated better. There was maybe the lineout Lawes won against the throw down near the Welsh line, could Youngs have got the ball away rather than being bowled over, maybe, but you'd be looking at the forwards to sort their shit out in the first instance. There was the ruck where he set to go left and didn't seem to know the backline was swinging around behind him, perhaps he never got a call, he still sent the ball right and England got a 3 on 2 (or maybe even a 3 on 1) and Farrell just bollcksed the play under no real pressure anyway, again not Youngs fault. There was one run in circle near the Welsh try line, I'd assume as this was when the crowd had woken up late on and it was just a communication failure, i.e. he didn't hear anything and the way he then picked was simply wrong, that can happen.

Mostly he passed rather than kicked, he didn't run much (and actually he wasn't great working back in defence, old legs maybe), and for all he can get some stick for one out passing he actually did look to pass wider. There were some one out passes, but that really came in phases where England had a 2 if not 3 man deficit, and surely that can't be a horror call?

So he didn't boot the ball away at every opportunity, you only need to have actually seen the game to know that rather than make such assumption. And I suppose he could have tried to link the wingers into play, why for instance are England willing to have Cokanasiga work off his wing but not Daly and Arundell, but that's a coaching call whatever the right/wrongs of it, and otherwise it's not really on the 9 to feed the wingers


ETA

Also he wasn't exclusive in his optimistic running in behind, but he did venture a few such supporting lines. Just in practice he spent most of his time running backwards/sideways to get to the ball, maybe he went a bit too deep at times, but hindsight is a wonderful thing to judge with

[SaintK]

A bit of light relief from the match!

[Hal Jordan]

JVP out with an ankle injury, Mitchell called up. JVP is in no way a choice of mine, but that's a bad way to have your campaign ended before it begins, he may never get another chance.

[SaintK]

Latest list. Actually pleasantly surprised by how many have picked up contracts already before the end of July. It looks like most of the senior squad will before the start of the season (albeit with the upheaval of unplanned moves and potential pay cuts). A few of those left like Loader and Collins sound like they have signed and are just waiting for announcements. Can't imagine the like of WGC, Ruiz, Basham and Morisi will have too much of an issue.

The others are likely struggling for prem or equivalent gigs.

Still some good academy prospects there. Vajner, Brooke, Bradbury and Harmes in particular.

Ben Atkins - Rams (ND1)
Matt Cornish - Ealing
Agustín Creevy - Sale
Ignacio Ruiz
Lovejoy Chawatama - Harlequins
Luke Green
Ciaran Parker
Danilo Fischetti - Zebre
Will Goodrick-Clarke
Ollie Hoskins - Saracens
Josh Caulfield - Bristol
Adam Coleman - Bordeaux
Chunya Munga - Northampton
Api Ratuniyarawa - Bayonne
Ed Scragg - Scarlets
Josh Basham
Ben Donnell - Gloucester
Jack Cooke
So'otala Fa'aso'o - Perpignan
Juan Martín González - Saracens
Izaia Moore-Aiono
Tom Pearson - Northampton
Matt Rogerson (c)- Leicester
Josh Smart
Caolan Englefield - Gloucester
Joe Powell - Leicester
Ben White - Toulon
Jacob Atkins - Rovigo
Paddy Jackson - Lyon
Rory Jennings - Newcastle
Tom Hitchcock - Ealing
Benhard Janse van Rensburg - Bristol
Will Joseph - Harlequins
Luca Morisi
Eddie Poolman
Matt Williams
Ben Loader
Lucio Cinti - Saracens
Henry Arundell - Racing 92
Kyle Rowe - Glasgow
Tom Collins
Michael Dykes - Gloucester

Calum Scott - Rams (ND1)
Joe Vajner
Afolabi Fasogbon - Gloucester
Tarek Haffar - Northampton
Mikey Summerfield - Bath
Chandler Cunningham-South - Harlequins
Jarlath Gleeson - Lyon
Lucas Brooke
Ollie Allan - Leicester
Monty Bradbury
Conor Cross
George Makepeace-Cubitt - Rams (ND1)
Jake Shortland
Jack Walsh
Alexander Harmes
Ralph McEachran - Sale
Rory Taylor - Gloucester
Finn Worley Brady
Toby Maddock
Charlie Moss

Bradbury just signed a 2 year contract at Glaws
Didn't realise that the L Irish attack coach James Lightfoot Brown had joined Gloucester as well

[JM2K6]

Any hints as to when we'll get the Farrell news? Best we can hope for is something lopsided - either long enough to rule him out entirely, or short enough not to matter.

[Joost]

Farrell apparently cleared and has his red rescinded!!

[JM2K6]

Yeah, just seen that. Well, lucky us.

Insane decision.

[Joost]

Yes, will be interested to hear the logic behind that one!

[inactionman]

Farrell apparently cleared and has his red rescinded!!

You're joking.

Surely you're joking?

[Big D]

Jesus H Christ. That is special.

[JM2K6]

No joke.

[Big D]

Yes, will be interested to hear the logic behind that one!

Edit: Grant Gilchrist got a 3 game ban for something similar IIRC.

[tc27]

Hahaha that is fucking nuts.

Wanted Ford to start but the outrage this will create will be delicious.

[clydecloggie]

Holy fuck. I mean, I posted exactly that defence as a joke and it turns out to be the actual view of the actual panel. Comedy is dead in this world.

[Raggs]

That's absolutely ludicrous. There was a dip, but it wasn't significant, Farrell was always upright and heading up, and his arm was fecking tucked!

The panel were Aussies right? Southern hemisphere don't have a clue when it comes to high tackles.

[JM2K6]

I must be incredibly stupid, because I thought the sudden change in direction was only mitigation if it turned a legal tackle into an illegal one. Farrell wasn't even trying to make a tackle before the push. The push made him tackle the guy, and he did so incredibly illegally - the change in direction had no bearing on that whatsoever.

Whatever you think about Farrell, this is an absurd call. World Rugby should immediately appeal it.

[Big D]

To be fair the reactions are going to be hilarious.

[Paddington Bear]

If you’re ever in trouble, instruct that KC.


On the one hand this is terrible for the game and player safety, on the other it is going to absolutely rattle the entire rugby world. So who’s to say whether it is a good or bad thing

[JM2K6]

If you’re ever in trouble, instruct that KC.


On the one hand this is terrible for the game and player safety, on the other it is going to absolutely rattle the entire rugby world. So who’s to say whether it is a good or bad thing

And to think I thought the Ashes would be the end of people including me being Extremely Rattled By Sport this summer.

[Paddington Bear]

If you’re ever in trouble, instruct that KC.


On the one hand this is terrible for the game and player safety, on the other it is going to absolutely rattle the entire rugby world. So who’s to say whether it is a good or bad thing

And to think I thought the Ashes would be the end of people including me being Extremely Rattled By Sport this summer.

The exact same thing crossed my mind!

[Hal Jordan]

Fucking joke shop decision, but at least we'll be spared the narrative that we would have won only if we had World Class Farrell from the start.

[ASMO]

No wonder people laugh in their faces when they say player safety is paramount.

Guarantee he will do it again v Argentina he just cant help himself.

[Ovals]

Utterly ridiculous decision - makes the whole process a farce.

[Big D]

Will be interesting to see if WR appeal this. I think they get 48hrs to appeal.

[Joost]

If you’re ever in trouble, instruct that KC.

Quite! Expect he also got Farrell knighted in the new years honours list and Basham will have to pay to have his face mark washed out of Farrell’s shirt

[Paddington Bear]

If you’re ever in trouble, instruct that KC.

Quite! Expect he also got Farrell knighted in the new years honours list and Basham will have to pay to have his face mark washed out of Farrell’s shirt

Forget the name but there’s a trashy Will Ferrell film where he ends up punching a baby and complains that none of the press coverage focuses on the damage to his fist caused by the baby’s iron jaw. Springs to mind

[KingBlairhorn]

Unbelievable decision.

What is refreshing is seeing the general confusion from English fans and the near universal (that I have seen) condemnation of the decision. This comes just a week after the same reaction from Scottish fans to the short ban for Fagerson. World Rugby obviously don't take player safety seriously but it's nice to see fans are generally on board.

[Torquemada 1420]

Unbelievable decision.

What is refreshing is seeing the general confusion from English fans and the near universal (that I have seen) condemnation of the decision. This comes just a week after the same reaction from Scottish fans to the short ban for Fagerson. World Rugby obviously don't take player safety seriously but it's nice to see fans are generally on board.

Let's see what Kawazaki has to say

[SaintK]

Unbelievable decision.

What is refreshing is seeing the general confusion from English fans and the near universal (that I have seen) condemnation of the decision. This comes just a week after the same reaction from Scottish fans to the short ban for Fagerson. World Rugby obviously don't take player safety seriously but it's nice to see fans are generally on board.

Let's see what Kawazaki has to say

He's away at the moment. He was chairing the disciplinary panel!!!