NPR

Posted: **Thu Oct 29, 2020 12:15 pm**

Pack is fine.

Backs are awful.

Youngs to have his one in ten game to retain his place.
Farrell at 10, we'll, it's only Italy, thankfully.
Slade, who is a classy if slightly prone to the odd defensive lapse 13, is at 12.
JJ fine.
May fine.
Watson should be at 15 with Thorley starting. Furbank benched as a break glass in case of emergency selection.

Posted: **Thu Oct 29, 2020 12:53 pm**

SaintK wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 11:31 am
sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 11:24 am I wanted to see Willis, Underhill and Curry in the same back row, but I knew that Billy would play. A little surprised Willis isn't in the 23.

Slade at 12 is interesting. Looking at his physique and skillset, it really should be a good position for him, but there's a reason Exeter have basically used him exclusively at 13 for a while.

Thought Ewels would start alongside Itoje as he's a lineout caller isn't he?

We can only hope Furbank was tearing it up in training otherwise 11. May 14. Thorley. 15. Watson would have been the better call.

Very excited to see an England game again after so many months.
I'm sure you will at some stage this Autumn

Furbank's selection is as almost surprising as Spencer's non selection

Would assume so. I suppose as this is a 6 Nations game and potentially affects the title tilt Eddie's mainly going with the tried and tested even though it's Italy.

Perhaps young George is Eddie's new "I see something in him that no one else does" player?

Posted: **Thu Oct 29, 2020 12:59 pm**

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 12:53 pm
SaintK wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 11:31 am
sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 11:24 am I wanted to see Willis, Underhill and Curry in the same back row, but I knew that Billy would play. A little surprised Willis isn't in the 23.

Slade at 12 is interesting. Looking at his physique and skillset, it really should be a good position for him, but there's a reason Exeter have basically used him exclusively at 13 for a while.

Thought Ewels would start alongside Itoje as he's a lineout caller isn't he?

We can only hope Furbank was tearing it up in training otherwise 11. May 14. Thorley. 15. Watson would have been the better call.

Very excited to see an England game again after so many months.
I'm sure you will at some stage this Autumn

Furbank's selection is as almost surprising as Spencer's non selection
Would assume so. I suppose as this is a 6 Nations game and potentially affects the title tilt Eddie's mainly going with the tried and tested even though it's Italy.

Perhaps young George is Eddie's new "I see something in him that no one else does" player?

He can't have watched any of his recent games for Tampon where he was utterly gash.

Posted: **Thu Oct 29, 2020 1:18 pm**

Random1 wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 12:04 pm So, Jonny Hill. He going to be a good partner for Maro?

What does he bring to the party?

Haven’t watched much rugby in the last 18 months due to work and a new baby eating all my fucking time - so I’m out of the loop on him.

He brings proper bastardry, high workrate, an eye for the tryline, and excellent lineout work. He's an excellent lock.

Posted: **Thu Oct 29, 2020 3:36 pm**

Hal Jordan wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 12:15 pm Pack is fine.

Backs are awful.

Youngs to have his one in ten game to retain his place.
Farrell at 10, we'll, it's only Italy, thankfully.
Slade, who is a classy if slightly prone to the odd defensive lapse 13, is at 12.
JJ fine.
May fine.
Watson should be at 15 with Thorley starting. Furbank benched as a break glass in case of emergency selection.

Posted: **Thu Oct 29, 2020 4:31 pm**

ASMO wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 11:03 am Well here is the team

It's fucking horseshit.

It what world is Furbank a better fullback than Watson or Malins?

Posted: **Thu Oct 29, 2020 4:36 pm**

Whoever is Italy coach, just get the halfbacks to practice upandunders, that's literally all they need to do and hound the shit out of Furbank. He's flakier than a tramp's scalp.

Posted: **Thu Oct 29, 2020 10:08 pm**

JM2K6 wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 1:18 pm
Random1 wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 12:04 pm So, Jonny Hill. He going to be a good partner for Maro?

What does he bring to the party?

Haven’t watched much rugby in the last 18 months due to work and a new baby eating all my fucking time - so I’m out of the loop on him.
He brings proper bastardry, high workrate, an eye for the tryline, and excellent lineout work. He's an excellent lock.

Excellent. A hard edge is defo a RWC take away for me. I’d like to see us bully someone like we get bullied by SA.

Posted: **Thu Oct 29, 2020 11:02 pm**

Random1 wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 10:08 pm
JM2K6 wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 1:18 pm
Random1 wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 12:04 pm So, Jonny Hill. He going to be a good partner for Maro?

What does he bring to the party?

Haven’t watched much rugby in the last 18 months due to work and a new baby eating all my fucking time - so I’m out of the loop on him.
He brings proper bastardry, high workrate, an eye for the tryline, and excellent lineout work. He's an excellent lock.
Excellent. A hard edge is defo a RWC take away for me. I’d like to see us bully someone like we get bullied by SA.

Most sides we can physically bully, even if it doesn't always translate to points. There's SA and likely France who can not only on a given day get parity but bully us physically. Going from where we are now to physically bullying SA seems a bigger ask than finding some ways to score points without being so reliant on dominating a side physically

Posted: **Fri Oct 30, 2020 7:26 am**

Rhubarb & Custard wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 11:02 pm
Random1 wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 10:08 pm
JM2K6 wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 1:18 pm

He brings proper bastardry, high workrate, an eye for the tryline, and excellent lineout work. He's an excellent lock.
Excellent. A hard edge is defo a RWC take away for me. I’d like to see us bully someone like we get bullied by SA.
Most sides we can physically bully, even if it doesn't always translate to points. There's SA and likely France who can not only on a given day get parity but bully us physically. Going from where we are now to physically bullying SA seems a bigger ask than finding some ways to score points without being so reliant on dominating a side physically

Dunno - I think with sinks and eventually genge, one more with a touch of nasty might make a big difference in terms of balance. The whole pack doesn’t have to be enforcement types.

Posted: **Fri Oct 30, 2020 8:36 am**

Please God, I hope not!!!!

Head coach Eddie Jones says Ben Youngs can win 150 caps for England, with the scrum-half set to reach a century against Italy on Saturday.

Youngs, 31, is the second men's player to reach the landmark and is closing in on Jason Leonard's record of 114.

"I've got the utmost admiration for him," said Jones. "He has really worked hard at his game to get himself back to his best. He's been outstanding for us.

"There is no reason why he can't get to 150, that's the goal for him."

Posted: **Fri Oct 30, 2020 8:44 am**

Random1 wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 10:08 pm
JM2K6 wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 1:18 pm
Random1 wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 12:04 pm So, Jonny Hill. He going to be a good partner for Maro?

What does he bring to the party?

Haven’t watched much rugby in the last 18 months due to work and a new baby eating all my fucking time - so I’m out of the loop on him.
He brings proper bastardry, high workrate, an eye for the tryline, and excellent lineout work. He's an excellent lock.
Excellent. A hard edge is defo a RWC take away for me. I’d like to see us bully someone like we get bullied by SA.

I'd say bullying teams is a theme behind almost every win of the Jones era. It's why he wheeled the Hask back out, no?

Posted: **Fri Oct 30, 2020 8:48 am**

Random1 wrote: ↑Fri Oct 30, 2020 7:26 am
Rhubarb & Custard wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 11:02 pm
Random1 wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 10:08 pm

Excellent. A hard edge is defo a RWC take away for me. I’d like to see us bully someone like we get bullied by SA.
Most sides we can physically bully, even if it doesn't always translate to points. There's SA and likely France who can not only on a given day get parity but bully us physically. Going from where we are now to physically bullying SA seems a bigger ask than finding some ways to score points without being so reliant on dominating a side physically
Dunno - I think with sinks and eventually genge, one more with a touch of nasty might make a big difference in terms of balance. The whole pack doesn’t have to be enforcement types.

pretty much that pack got beaten up badly in the WC final. perhaps on another day they'd get closer to or actual parity, but to go from that game to dominating SA seems like more than changing a couple of players, especially when for all I love Sinckler his game doesn't scream dominating the scrum and maul

Posted: **Fri Oct 30, 2020 9:23 am**

Random1 wrote: ↑Fri Oct 30, 2020 7:26 am
Rhubarb & Custard wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 11:02 pm
Random1 wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 10:08 pm

Excellent. A hard edge is defo a RWC take away for me. I’d like to see us bully someone like we get bullied by SA.
Most sides we can physically bully, even if it doesn't always translate to points. There's SA and likely France who can not only on a given day get parity but bully us physically. Going from where we are now to physically bullying SA seems a bigger ask than finding some ways to score points without being so reliant on dominating a side physically
Dunno - I think with sinks and eventually genge, one more with a touch of nasty might make a big difference in terms of balance. The whole pack doesn’t have to be enforcement types.

Sinckler and Genge are not enforcers at all, not even close.

Posted: **Fri Oct 30, 2020 9:45 am**

Rhubarb & Custard wrote: ↑Fri Oct 30, 2020 8:48 am
Random1 wrote: ↑Fri Oct 30, 2020 7:26 am
Rhubarb & Custard wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 11:02 pm

Most sides we can physically bully, even if it doesn't always translate to points. There's SA and likely France who can not only on a given day get parity but bully us physically. Going from where we are now to physically bullying SA seems a bigger ask than finding some ways to score points without being so reliant on dominating a side physically
Dunno - I think with sinks and eventually genge, one more with a touch of nasty might make a big difference in terms of balance. The whole pack doesn’t have to be enforcement types.
pretty much that pack got beaten up badly in the WC final. perhaps on another day they'd get closer to or actual parity, but to go from that game to dominating SA seems like more than changing a couple of players, especially when for all I love Sinckler his game doesn't scream dominating the scrum and maul

Yep, our problems with SA go beyond a couple of personnel changes and have existed for most of the last 15 years.

Posted: **Fri Oct 30, 2020 9:50 am**

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Fri Oct 30, 2020 9:45 am
Rhubarb & Custard wrote: ↑Fri Oct 30, 2020 8:48 am
Random1 wrote: ↑Fri Oct 30, 2020 7:26 am

Dunno - I think with sinks and eventually genge, one more with a touch of nasty might make a big difference in terms of balance. The whole pack doesn’t have to be enforcement types.
pretty much that pack got beaten up badly in the WC final. perhaps on another day they'd get closer to or actual parity, but to go from that game to dominating SA seems like more than changing a couple of players, especially when for all I love Sinckler his game doesn't scream dominating the scrum and maul
Yep, our problems with SA go beyond a couple of personnel changes and have existed for most of the last 15 years.

And even if we had the players I wouldn't want to play like SA, though granted I don't much want to play like England either

Posted: **Fri Oct 30, 2020 9:53 am**

We always struggle against SA, but I still maintain that Sinckler getting knocked out in the first minutes of the game affected the team because it wasn't through the actions of the opposition, which gives a rallying point, but a nasty accident. Itoje looked rattled in particular. Sinckler to Cole was a massive hole in the game plan, as well, as we swapped a mobile ball carrier with great hands for a near immobile slug.

Posted: **Fri Oct 30, 2020 10:04 am**

Immobile? Did you not see our scrum?

ETA - We struggle against SA because the matchup for our game isn't a good one, from which point we can either double down on plan A, or try a different style of game. Plenty of teams beat SA, they don't tend to do it by getting into an arm wrestle

Posted: **Fri Oct 30, 2020 10:28 am**

Rhubarb & Custard wrote: ↑Fri Oct 30, 2020 10:04 am Immobile? Did you not see our scrum?

ETA - We struggle against SA because the matchup for our game isn't a good one, from which point we can either double down on plan A, or try a different style of game. Plenty of teams beat SA, they don't tend to do it by getting into an arm wrestle

Honestly i just think England played their final against NZ the week before and they were mentally not at the races.

Posted: **Fri Oct 30, 2020 10:40 am**

ASMO wrote: ↑Fri Oct 30, 2020 10:28 am
Rhubarb & Custard wrote: ↑Fri Oct 30, 2020 10:04 am Immobile? Did you not see our scrum?

ETA - We struggle against SA because the matchup for our game isn't a good one, from which point we can either double down on plan A, or try a different style of game. Plenty of teams beat SA, they don't tend to do it by getting into an arm wrestle
Honestly i just think England played their final against NZ the week before and they were mentally not at the races.

That certainly exacerbated things, but we've struggled against SA for years.

Posted: **Fri Oct 30, 2020 12:44 pm**

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Fri Oct 30, 2020 10:40 am
ASMO wrote: ↑Fri Oct 30, 2020 10:28 am
Rhubarb & Custard wrote: ↑Fri Oct 30, 2020 10:04 am Immobile? Did you not see our scrum?

ETA - We struggle against SA because the matchup for our game isn't a good one, from which point we can either double down on plan A, or try a different style of game. Plenty of teams beat SA, they don't tend to do it by getting into an arm wrestle
Honestly i just think England played their final against NZ the week before and they were mentally not at the races.
That certainly exacerbated things, but we've struggled against SA for years.

Agreed, both were issues. But if we include the NZ match we should also note the Aussie match was a physical pasting against a very big Aussie backline, whilst SA were busy leaning on Japan and then playing tennis against Wales.

I'm still not sure we'd play those same teams again though as from the final and win more than 3 or 4 times out of 10 with the same tactics with both sides fresh going into the game.

Posted: **Fri Oct 30, 2020 1:01 pm**

Rhubarb & Custard wrote: ↑Fri Oct 30, 2020 12:44 pm
sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Fri Oct 30, 2020 10:40 am
ASMO wrote: ↑Fri Oct 30, 2020 10:28 am

Honestly i just think England played their final against NZ the week before and they were mentally not at the races.
That certainly exacerbated things, but we've struggled against SA for years.
Agreed, both were issues. But if we include the NZ match we should also note the Aussie match was a physical pasting against a very big Aussie backline, whilst SA were busy leaning on Japan and then playing tennis against Wales.

I'm still not sure we'd play those same teams again though as from the final and win more than 3 or 4 times out of 10 with the same tactics with both sides fresh going into the game.

I think most the time we don't lose Sinkler so early, and then we have at least a 40% chance. Take away the drain from NZ, and I'd put us to 50/50.

Posted: **Fri Oct 30, 2020 1:19 pm**

The late arrival at the stadium too.
Some players have really set routines of getting game ready.

My memory of the game was that the team looked rattled right from the kick off.

Posted: **Fri Oct 30, 2020 1:23 pm**

When will the RFU name the full list of those breaking the Babas Covid quarantine?

Just looked at BBC
The list is
Richard Wigglesworth, Sean Maitland, Jackson Wray, Manu Vunipola, Tim Swinson, Calum Clark, Tom de Glanville, Joel Kpoku, Simon Kerrod, Fergus McFadden, Juan Pablo Socino and Alex Lewington plus Robshaw.

Posted: **Fri Oct 30, 2020 1:34 pm**

Glaston wrote: ↑Fri Oct 30, 2020 1:23 pm When will the RFU name the full list of those breaking the Babas Covid quarantine?

Just looked at BBC
The list is
Richard Wigglesworth, Sean Maitland, Jackson Wray, Manu Vunipola, Tim Swinson, Calum Clark, Tom de Glanville, Joel Kpoku, Simon Kerrod, Fergus McFadden, Juan Pablo Socino and Alex Lewington plus Robshaw.

The article says they'll publish it after the hearings.

Posted: **Fri Oct 30, 2020 5:18 pm**

JM2K6 wrote: ↑Fri Oct 30, 2020 1:34 pm
Glaston wrote: ↑Fri Oct 30, 2020 1:23 pm When will the RFU name the full list of those breaking the Babas Covid quarantine?

Just looked at BBC
The list is
Richard Wigglesworth, Sean Maitland, Jackson Wray, Manu Vunipola, Tim Swinson, Calum Clark, Tom de Glanville, Joel Kpoku, Simon Kerrod, Fergus McFadden, Juan Pablo Socino and Alex Lewington plus Robshaw.

The article says they'll publish it after the hearings.

Big Sarries contingent there. I think the senior players have really let the young guys down. I fear it will be the likes of Vunipola, de Glanville and Kpoku whose careers suffer most from this.

Posted: **Fri Oct 30, 2020 7:35 pm**

RFU have cancelled all adult rugby below Level 3 for men and 2 for women. That's a nice grassroots game you got there. Shame if something happened to it.

Posted: **Fri Oct 30, 2020 7:44 pm**

Hal Jordan wrote: ↑Fri Oct 30, 2020 7:35 pm RFU have cancelled all adult rugby below Level 3 for men and 2 for women. That's a nice grassroots game you got there. Shame if something happened to it.

No. They've cancelled the 2020/21 league games. In the opinion that there simply wouldn't be time to complete them, even if contact does come back. Big difference between cancelling the leagues, and cancelling all adult rugby.

Posted: **Fri Oct 30, 2020 8:20 pm**

Back to invitational Old Buggertonians 3rds vs Boot Money 5ths matches, then?

Posted: **Sat Oct 31, 2020 8:07 am**

Raggs wrote: ↑Fri Oct 30, 2020 7:44 pm
Hal Jordan wrote: ↑Fri Oct 30, 2020 7:35 pm RFU have cancelled all adult rugby below Level 3 for men and 2 for women. That's a nice grassroots game you got there. Shame if something happened to it.
No. They've cancelled the 2020/21 league games. In the opinion that there simply wouldn't be time to complete them, even if contact does come back. Big difference between cancelling the leagues, and cancelling all adult rugby.

I’m still wondering just how many clubs will actually fold with no revenue from bar takings coming in

Posted: **Sat Oct 31, 2020 9:57 pm**

Wohooo

Posted: **Sat Oct 31, 2020 10:11 pm**

2020 is good actually

Posted: **Mon Nov 02, 2020 10:11 am**

Hal Jordan wrote: ↑Fri Oct 30, 2020 8:20 pm Back to invitational Old Buggertonians 3rds vs Boot Money 5ths matches, then?

Much more involved in club cricket and we ended up with half a season. Scrapped promotion and relegation, played the games as essentially a merit table, no club pros. Most enjoyable season I've had in years, competitive without the silliness. Both sides having beers together.
I suspect as and when we get some club rugby people might be surprised how much they enjoy the 'new normal'.

Posted: **Mon Nov 02, 2020 10:47 am**

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Mon Nov 02, 2020 10:11 am
Hal Jordan wrote: ↑Fri Oct 30, 2020 8:20 pm Back to invitational Old Buggertonians 3rds vs Boot Money 5ths matches, then?
Much more involved in club cricket and we ended up with half a season. Scrapped promotion and relegation, played the games as essentially a merit table, no club pros. Most enjoyable season I've had in years, competitive without the silliness. Both sides having beers together.
I suspect as and when we get some club rugby people might be surprised how much they enjoy the 'new normal'.

I think you mean IF

Posted: **Mon Nov 02, 2020 10:51 am**

SaintK wrote: ↑Mon Nov 02, 2020 10:47 am
Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Mon Nov 02, 2020 10:11 am
Hal Jordan wrote: ↑Fri Oct 30, 2020 8:20 pm Back to invitational Old Buggertonians 3rds vs Boot Money 5ths matches, then?
Much more involved in club cricket and we ended up with half a season. Scrapped promotion and relegation, played the games as essentially a merit table, no club pros. Most enjoyable season I've had in years, competitive without the silliness. Both sides having beers together.
I suspect as and when we get some club rugby people might be surprised how much they enjoy the 'new normal'.
I think you mean IF

I suppose so. It's hard to see how you can have a scrum for a year or so, and maybe more.

Posted: **Mon Nov 02, 2020 11:57 am**

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Mon Nov 02, 2020 10:51 am
SaintK wrote: ↑Mon Nov 02, 2020 10:47 am
Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Mon Nov 02, 2020 10:11 am

Much more involved in club cricket and we ended up with half a season. Scrapped promotion and relegation, played the games as essentially a merit table, no club pros. Most enjoyable season I've had in years, competitive without the silliness. Both sides having beers together.
I suspect as and when we get some club rugby people might be surprised how much they enjoy the 'new normal'.
I think you mean IF
I suppose so. It's hard to see how you can have a scrum for a year or so, and maybe more.

Agreed on the cricket, more enjoyable. Slightly less looked-after pitches favoured the bowlers, which made games more exciting as rarely were the batsmen dominant and looking completely set.

As for rugby, I do not understand why schools and clubs have not started playing league rules much earlier. If you get rid of the "scrums", the level of contact is similar to football which has been given the green light. At least it would mean players would remain used to contact rather than incessant sessions of touch.

Posted: **Mon Nov 02, 2020 7:06 pm**

eatingpopcorn.gif

Posted: **Mon Nov 02, 2020 7:12 pm**

Niegs wrote: ↑Mon Nov 02, 2020 7:06 pm eatingpopcorn.gif

Saw that one myself and had a chuckle.

A journo like Charlie Morgan is the antithesis of Walrus. The more like him writing for big publications, the better.

Posted: **Tue Nov 03, 2020 11:19 am**

This will get a few people exercised i am sure.

https://www.rugbypass.com/news/saracens ... gTGpYs7y_I

Posted: **Tue Nov 03, 2020 11:30 am**

The idea makes sense given the financial circumstances - Ealing and Sarries do offer financial stability. Appreciate there will be some who'd quite like to see Sarries die but I can't be expected to support that, and I suspect cooler heads will prevail.
No way we get a full championship, the only other alternative I could see is a smaller Champ of teams that want to compete for the year.
Of course a 14 team league offers more TV so more £££ as well.

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