NPR

Will believe it when I see it. If there is anything left by then

English rugby's powerbrokers have announced plans to revitalise the game in England after admitting they have "failed miserably" when it comes to developing young talent.
As part of a landmark new partnership, the Rugby Football Union plans to create a revamped second tier from the 2025-2026 season.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/67772805

There is plenty of young talent, we just don't use it (except at 12).

Sale and Sarries serving up some shite rugby
The wind isn’t helping but sheeeesh!!!
Sarries scrum getting mullered but they’re 10 7 up at halftime thanks to an interception try on 40 minutes

SaintK wrote: ↑Fri Dec 22, 2023 9:02 am Will believe it when I see it. If there is anything left by then

English rugby's powerbrokers have announced plans to revitalise the game in England after admitting they have "failed miserably" when it comes to developing young talent.
As part of a landmark new partnership, the Rugby Football Union plans to create a revamped second tier from the 2025-2026 season.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/67772805

Pirates sound very pissed off with the RFU.

https://cornish-pirates.com/rugby/champ ... TfKRiV0UuE

Some game at the Rec

Danny Care adding to his considerable yellow card tally. Must be the highest of any 9 ever.

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Sat Dec 23, 2023 3:43 pm Danny Care adding to his considerable yellow card tally. Must be the highest of any 9 ever.

That had to be a penalty try, surely?

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Sat Dec 23, 2023 3:39 pm Some game at the Rec

Yep, very enjoyable.
I swear Russell converted the Bath try but it's not showing on the score. Could be my eyesight mind!

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Sat Dec 23, 2023 3:50 pm

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Sat Dec 23, 2023 3:43 pm Danny Care adding to his considerable yellow card tally. Must be the highest of any 9 ever.

That had to be a penalty try, surely?

I suppose Pearce would argue that Spencer was already tackled and not in the act of scoring, so although the action against him was illegal it wasn't obviously preventing a try? Care also didn't interfere with a ball that had already been released towards a Bath player, Spencer was still in posession.

Think that's reaching, though. It very much felt like the sort of cynical incident that is supposed to result in a pen try.

Launchbury

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Sat Dec 23, 2023 3:59 pm

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Sat Dec 23, 2023 3:50 pm

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Sat Dec 23, 2023 3:43 pm Danny Care adding to his considerable yellow card tally. Must be the highest of any 9 ever.

That had to be a penalty try, surely?

I suppose Pearce would argue that Spencer was already tackled and not in the act of scoring, so although the action against him was illegal it wasn't obviously preventing a try? Care also didn't interfere with a ball that had already been released towards a Bath player, Spencer was still in posession.

Think that's reaching, though. It very much felt like the sort of cynical incident that is supposed to result in a pen try.

Smith gets over the ball regardless of cares actions, and there were other quin's back. It's close, but I don't think it was the wrong call.

Btw, didn't Find get the first conversion?

First conversion fell short, didn’t have the legs

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Sat Dec 23, 2023 4:16 pm First conversion fell short, didn’t have the legs

Aaah

Still not sure how I feel about Bath being decent again, but fair play to van Graan. Stabilised then last season and so far this season they look as likely as any side to be in the playoff hunt.

Just watching sarries vs connacht, how's Hartley been doing at 12? Liked the look of him at age grade with Wasps, and he always seems to get a couple of highlights in a game. Decent enough hands, but also a physical presence. Anyone reckon he might get a look in for the 6n? Squad, not necessarily gametime.

A blessing disguise?

Sale centre Manu Tuilagi is now a doubt for England's Six Nations Opener with Italy, having suffered another groin injury.
The 32-year-old doesn't require surgery, but early estimates suggest he could be out of action for around six weeks, after picking up the injury while in action for Sale against Saracens.

SaintK wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 12:28 pm A blessing disguise?

Sale centre Manu Tuilagi is now a doubt for England's Six Nations Opener with Italy, having suffered another groin injury.
The 32-year-old doesn't require surgery, but early estimates suggest he could be out of action for around six weeks, after picking up the injury while in action for Sale against Saracens.

We absolutely have to get over and past him. He's not even been particularly good in most of his recent England appearances.

England will be a better team by using one of the younger options like Lawrence, Kelly or Dingwall.

Lawrence is a 13.

I still like the look of Ojomoh, and having caught up a bit with Hartley, reckon he could do a job too. Kelly I think looked fairly handy too. All very young, but got to be worth trying to get them into the setup to try and go forward.

Raggs wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 1:31 pm Lawrence is a 13.

I still like the look of Ojomoh, and having caught up a bit with Hartley, reckon he could do a job too. Kelly I think looked fairly handy too. All very young, but got to be worth trying to get them into the setup to try and go forward.

So was Manu for most of his career. True, it might not get the best use out of him, but Lawrence has already shown he can a job at 12 if required and that might be what's best for the team. Especially as I don't see Borthwick being too gung ho when it comes to taking punts on any of the others young and/or untested players we forum dwellers consider to be options.

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 2:00 pm

Raggs wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 1:31 pm Lawrence is a 13.

I still like the look of Ojomoh, and having caught up a bit with Hartley, reckon he could do a job too. Kelly I think looked fairly handy too. All very young, but got to be worth trying to get them into the setup to try and go forward.

So was Manu for most of his career. True, it might not get the best use out of him, but Lawrence has already shown he can a job at 12 if required and that might be what's best for the team. Especially as I don't see Borthwick being too gung ho when it comes to taking punts on any of the others young and/or untested players we forum dwellers consider to be options.

Lawrence can do a job, but he doesn't excel there, especially when paired with most of the other 13s we have, they're mostly similar in how they play. I'd rather we go for an actual 12.

Raggs wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 1:31 pm Lawrence is a 13.

I still like the look of Ojomoh, and having caught up a bit with Hartley, reckon he could do a job too. Kelly I think looked fairly handy too. All very young, but got to be worth trying to get them into the setup to try and go forward.

Kelly has been on fairly poor form for Tigers the last few weeks. Hopefully just a blip!

SaintK wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 2:06 pm

Raggs wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 1:31 pm Lawrence is a 13.

I still like the look of Ojomoh, and having caught up a bit with Hartley, reckon he could do a job too. Kelly I think looked fairly handy too. All very young, but got to be worth trying to get them into the setup to try and go forward.

Kelly has been on fairly poor form for Tigers the last few weeks. Hopefully just a blip!

Just taking a quick look, he's been playing 13 by the looks of it

He certainly was the other week when I caught them, Kata was playing 12 and Dingwall plays 13 with Hutchinson at 12 quite a bit for Saints.

It's all very well saying Lawrence isn't a 12 or we don't get the best out of him at there, but then who is an 'actual' 12? In the Prem at the moment it seems to either be non-EQPs or kids. Which means making the best of things and picking one of your better centres who can handle it in that slot.

I also think that pretty much every centre who isn't an absolute plodder looks better from 13 where they've got a bit more time and space to operate, so don't consider it much of an argument against playing them at 12 if required.

Cracking video about barbeary’s injury and return.

Exeter pretty gash, but Bristol making them look competant, do like the look of the Exeter wing though.

ASMO wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 9:13 pm Exeter pretty gash, but Bristol making them look competant, do like the look of the Exeter wing though.

The Exeter wing that’s both England and wales qualified? And therefore certain that England will ignore and wales will give an early cap to to lock him in?

Sinkers wrote: ↑Sat Dec 30, 2023 12:17 pm

ASMO wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 9:13 pm Exeter pretty gash, but Bristol making them look competant, do like the look of the Exeter wing though.

The Exeter wing that’s both England and wales qualified? And therefore certain that England will ignore and wales will give an early cap to to lock him in?

Immanuel Feyi-Waboso was born in Wales and was part of Cardiff academy. Moved to Birmingham to study medicine and joined Wasps and then Exeter when Wasps went bust. Has already trained with the wider Welsh squad. Looks an outstanding prospect so will probably be ignored by Borthwick!
Hopefully Borthwick will have noted the performances of recent England U20 lads Fisilau and Tuima in the Exeter pack.

SaintK wrote: ↑Sat Dec 30, 2023 12:37 pm

Sinkers wrote: ↑Sat Dec 30, 2023 12:17 pm

ASMO wrote: ↑Fri Dec 29, 2023 9:13 pm Exeter pretty gash, but Bristol making them look competant, do like the look of the Exeter wing though.

The Exeter wing that’s both England and wales qualified? And therefore certain that England will ignore and wales will give an early cap to to lock him in?

Immanuel Feyi-Waboso was born in Wales and was part of Cardiff academy. Moved to Birmingham to study medicine and joined Wasps and then Exeter when Wasps went bust. Has already trained with the wider Welsh squad. Looks an outstanding prospect so will probably be ignored by Borthwick!
Hopefully Borthwick will have noted the performances of recent England U20 lads Fisilau and Tuima in the Exeter pack.

Can Wales select Waboso when he's playing in England - does the minimum cap rule not apply to him.

Ovals wrote: ↑Sat Dec 30, 2023 12:54 pm

SaintK wrote: ↑Sat Dec 30, 2023 12:37 pm

Sinkers wrote: ↑Sat Dec 30, 2023 12:17 pm


The Exeter wing that’s both England and wales qualified? And therefore certain that England will ignore and wales will give an early cap to to lock him in?

Immanuel Feyi-Waboso was born in Wales and was part of Cardiff academy. Moved to Birmingham to study medicine and joined Wasps and then Exeter when Wasps went bust. Has already trained with the wider Welsh squad. Looks an outstanding prospect so will probably be ignored by Borthwick!
Hopefully Borthwick will have noted the performances of recent England U20 lads Fisilau and Tuima in the Exeter pack.

Can Wales select Waboso when he's playing in England - does the minimum cap rule not apply to him.

Not sure that applies to uncapped players. Also isn't young Jenkins the Exeter second row p[laying for Wales without the minimum cap rule applying?

Ovals wrote: ↑Sat Dec 30, 2023 12:54 pm

SaintK wrote: ↑Sat Dec 30, 2023 12:37 pm

Sinkers wrote: ↑Sat Dec 30, 2023 12:17 pm


The Exeter wing that’s both England and wales qualified? And therefore certain that England will ignore and wales will give an early cap to to lock him in?

Immanuel Feyi-Waboso was born in Wales and was part of Cardiff academy. Moved to Birmingham to study medicine and joined Wasps and then Exeter when Wasps went bust. Has already trained with the wider Welsh squad. Looks an outstanding prospect so will probably be ignored by Borthwick!
Hopefully Borthwick will have noted the performances of recent England U20 lads Fisilau and Tuima in the Exeter pack.

Can Wales select Waboso when he's playing in England - does the minimum cap rule not apply to him.

Yes, it'll be no different to Rees-Zammit. Players first capped while under contract outside of Wales aren't subject to the cap rule and can continue to be picked for the duration of that contract. Once it expires they are expected to move back to Wales if a region makes a 'market rate offer' (which surely must have some additional specificity to it beyond what's routinely mentioned in the media) in order to continue being selected. If they return, payers must then accrue 25 caps before selection from abroad becoms viable again.

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Sat Dec 30, 2023 1:18 pm

Ovals wrote: ↑Sat Dec 30, 2023 12:54 pm

SaintK wrote: ↑Sat Dec 30, 2023 12:37 pm
Immanuel Feyi-Waboso was born in Wales and was part of Cardiff academy. Moved to Birmingham to study medicine and joined Wasps and then Exeter when Wasps went bust. Has already trained with the wider Welsh squad. Looks an outstanding prospect so will probably be ignored by Borthwick!
Hopefully Borthwick will have noted the performances of recent England U20 lads Fisilau and Tuima in the Exeter pack.

Can Wales select Waboso when he's playing in England - does the minimum cap rule not apply to him.

Yes, it'll be no different to Rees-Zammit. Players first capped while under contract outside of Wales aren't subject to the cap rule and can continue to be picked for the duration of that contract. Once it expires they are expected to move back to Wales if a region makes a 'market rate offer' (which surely must have some additional specificity to it beyond what's routinely mentioned in the media) in order to continue being selected. If they return, payers must then accrue 25 caps before selection from abroad becoms viable again.

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Sat Dec 30, 2023 1:18 pm

Ovals wrote: ↑Sat Dec 30, 2023 12:54 pm

SaintK wrote: ↑Sat Dec 30, 2023 12:37 pm
Immanuel Feyi-Waboso was born in Wales and was part of Cardiff academy. Moved to Birmingham to study medicine and joined Wasps and then Exeter when Wasps went bust. Has already trained with the wider Welsh squad. Looks an outstanding prospect so will probably be ignored by Borthwick!
Hopefully Borthwick will have noted the performances of recent England U20 lads Fisilau and Tuima in the Exeter pack.

Can Wales select Waboso when he's playing in England - does the minimum cap rule not apply to him.

Yes, it'll be no different to Rees-Zammit. Players first capped while under contract outside of Wales aren't subject to the cap rule and can continue to be picked for the duration of that contract. Once it expires they are expected to move back to Wales if a region makes a 'market rate offer' (which surely must have some additional specificity to it beyond what's routinely mentioned in the media) in order to continue being selected. If they return, payers must then accrue 25 caps before selection from abroad becoms viable again.

TBF - he is Welsh - it'd be a clear poach for England to select him. Either way, it's early days for him with just a handful of senior games. He certainly caught the eye last night though.

Good phase play from Saints to get their second try. Just Ford's drop goal separating the two teams with 15 to play.

Having heard an awful lot of hype about Opoku-Fordjour all I've really seen him do so far in the game is concede a couple of scrum penalties.

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Sat Dec 30, 2023 4:42 pm Good phase play from Saints to get their second try. Just Ford's drop goal separating the two teams with 15 to play.

Having heard an awful lot of hype about Opoku-Fordjour all I've really seen him do so far in the game is concede a couple of scrum penalties.

And now he's gotten himself binned and conceded a pen try for not getting onside for a quick tap.

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Sat Dec 30, 2023 4:42 pm Good phase play from Saints to get their second try. Just Ford's drop goal separating the two teams with 15 to play.

Having heard an awful lot of hype about Opoku-Fordjour all I've really seen him do so far in the game is concede a couple of scrum penalties.

Not his best game, mind, Northampton "painted a picture" for Carley at scrum time.

Disappointed in that, but Tampons fresher bench was the difference.

Excellent second half for Saints. Can't remember last time they topped the table?
Langdon has been an excellent signing. Could see him in the frame rfor an England squad call up.

The first couple of scrums with Asher just looked unbalanced, Waller working really hard to get in a great position. Saints overall had them in the scrum towards the end though. Schonert got a great hit when he had to come back on, Asher needs experience to pick up those tricks more, so far he's focusing on just being in a great position.

Saints just about managed to grind that back, Sale basically had defence, Ford, Warr and Roebuck (brilliant work in the air). Is Sleightholme poor in the air, or was Roebuck just genuinely miles better?

SaintK wrote: ↑Sat Dec 30, 2023 5:14 pm Excellent second half for Saints. Can't remember last time they topped the table?
Langdon has been an excellent signing. Could see him in the frame rfor an England squad call up.

I was gutted when he left us. We gambled on Ashman and it's not really paid off. Langdon really should be in the England frame now.

Well done on the win, you had us at the breakdown. We really need some of our injured players back, the squad is on the bones of its arse

Dommers basically just did this to Mercer