NPR

C69 wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 4:37 pm

salanya wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 4:35 pm

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 4:32 pm

You lost then too.

Appreciate that, but despite being a drop goal away, it didn't feel like it was going to happen today. Play has been relatively poor in recent weeks.

Really?

Yes

PCPhil wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 4:02 pm Might be a bum thought but perhaps Leinster's strategy of resting their big players before the Euro final then on the day expecting it all to click needs a rethink?

Ditto Gloucester. That tactic don't work anymore in the URC.

OomStruisbaai wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 5:25 pm

PCPhil wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 4:02 pm Might be a bum thought but perhaps Leinster's strategy of resting their big players before the Euro final then on the day expecting it all to click needs a rethink?

Ditto Gloucester. That tactic don't work anymore in the URC.

Funny. Sharks rested their side that won the Challenge Cup

Plus Leinster Ireland players would have done with a South African tour.

Sards wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 5:28 pm

OomStruisbaai wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 5:25 pm

PCPhil wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 4:02 pm Might be a bum thought but perhaps Leinster's strategy of resting their big players before the Euro final then on the day expecting it all to click needs a rethink?

Ditto Gloucester. That tactic don't work anymore in the URC.

Funny. Sharks rested their side that won the Challenge Cup

They play against the school of the blind. Sport Pienaar league.

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 4:32 pm

salanya wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 4:31 pm Well, maybe next year.

Not with Ross at 10 please, and back to playing the way we did in the last 2 years. Nienaber is no Lancaster.

Dupont won that today, some player.

You lost then too.

Irish teams don’t lose, they just sometimes score less than the opposition

OomStruisbaai wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 5:32 pm

Sards wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 5:28 pm

OomStruisbaai wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 5:25 pm

Ditto Gloucester. That tactic don't work anymore in the URC.

Funny. Sharks rested their side that won the Challenge Cup

They play against the school of the blind. Sport Pienaar league.

Stormers arrogance.

Think they are so much better than the rest


How did the Stormers do in the HC. Or CC....

Oh wait. They didn't make it

But they do vote DA

salanya wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 5:06 pm

C69 wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 4:37 pm

salanya wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 4:35 pm
Appreciate that, but despite being a drop goal away, it didn't feel like it was going to happen today. Play has been relatively poor in recent weeks.

Really?

Yes

Funny less than a 15 days ago you destroyed a team by 60 points

Sards wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 5:34 pm

OomStruisbaai wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 5:32 pm

Sards wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 5:28 pm

Funny. Sharks rested their side that won the Challenge Cup

They play against the school of the blind. Sport Pienaar league.

Stormers arrogance.

Think they are so much better than the rest


How did the Stormers do in the HC. Or CC....

Oh wait. They didn't make it

But they do vote DA

Cheetahs beat you in the Sport Pienaar. It's a no name competition. The Bulls will put 50 on you next week with their C team.

Slick wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 5:34 pm

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 4:32 pm

salanya wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 4:31 pm Well, maybe next year.

Not with Ross at 10 please, and back to playing the way we did in the last 2 years. Nienaber is no Lancaster.

Dupont won that today, some player.

You lost then too.

Irish teams don’t lose, they just sometimes score less than the opposition

I've spoken to you about this before but Leinster </=> Ireland.

Slick wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 4:18 pm

Torquemada 1420 wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 4:01 pm

Blackmac wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 3:56 pm Easiest Motm decision ever.

Defo.

Yet a significant number of people still claim he’s overrated

Uncle fester wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 6:09 pm

Slick wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 5:34 pm

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 4:32 pm

You lost then too.

Irish teams don’t lose, they just sometimes score less than the opposition

I've spoken to you about this before but Leinster </=> Ireland.

.

laurent wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 4:48 pm Thankfully Toulouse won that.

Leinster is just robotic with no spark.

FWIW, I had Toulouse by 10

OomStruisbaai wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 5:44 pm

They play against the school of the blind. Sport Pienaar league.


Cheetahs beat you in the Sport Pienaar. It's a no name competition. The Bulls will put 50 on you next week with their C team.

Ouch.

Trash talking the Sharks.

Classy stuff.

Arrogance from the Stormers.

Well I guess the Lions should rather stay at home and concede the 5 points because if they play the Stormers are going to moer them good and proper. Here from ouboet...first

No longer have a login to Planet Rugby. How are the Leinster chaps taking it?

Didn't see the match but seeing a lot of blame being directed at Byrne for being hopeless, and Cullen for his shite selection policy. How did the packs shape up against each other?

Jim Lahey wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 9:02 pm No longer have a login to Planet Rugby. How are the Leinster chaps taking it?

Didn't see the match but seeing a lot of blame being directed at Byrne for being hopeless, and Cullen for his shite selection policy. How did the packs shape up against each other?

Leinsters pack was excellent; the lineout was mostly very good, & they had the majority of the scrums.

Byrne isn't Sexton obviously, & when you slot him into a back line that was used to Sexton, his positioning & cadence breaks a backline that worked before, until everyone gets realigned. For me, Byrne sits too deep, & that means everyone else gets less time, & for this match it meant backs getting the ball standing still & with two world class players in their grill along with the ball.

I wasn't even vaguely optimistic about this match. Its one thing to take on France, it's another to take on France with DuPont; & that was the job today, & the difference between Leinster winning & losing.

I was hoping from a Connacht perspective that Leinster would win, & we'd be facing a hungover Leinster; now they've be fucking angry, & we're going to get absolutely reamed.

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 9:13 pm

Jim Lahey wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 9:02 pm No longer have a login to Planet Rugby. How are the Leinster chaps taking it?

Didn't see the match but seeing a lot of blame being directed at Byrne for being hopeless, and Cullen for his shite selection policy. How did the packs shape up against each other?

Leinsters pack was excellent; the lineout was mostly very good, & they had the majority of the scrums.

Byrne isn't Sexton obviously, & when you slot him into a back line that was used to Sexton, his positioning & cadence breaks a backline that worked before, until everyone gets realigned. For me, Byrne sits too deep, & that means everyone else gets less time, & for this match it meant backs getting the ball standing still & with two world class players in their grill along with the ball.

I wasn't even vaguely optimistic about this match. Its one thing to take on France, it's another to take on France with DuPont; & that was the job today, & the difference between Leinster winning & losing.

I was hoping from a Connacht perspective that Leinster would win, & we'd be facing a hungover Leinster; now they've be fucking angry, & we're going to get absolutely reamed.

Regarding Byrne, I think he has been treated a bit unfairly to be honest. He was replacing an Irish legend and whether it was to make him feel better, or Irish rugby to feel better, was talked up quite a bit beyond his current ability.

He’s a decent player and looks to have the skills to get even better, but some of the pressure piled on him by people taking him up has, I think, been unfair

Slick wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 10:19 pm

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 9:13 pm

Jim Lahey wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 9:02 pm No longer have a login to Planet Rugby. How are the Leinster chaps taking it?

Didn't see the match but seeing a lot of blame being directed at Byrne for being hopeless, and Cullen for his shite selection policy. How did the packs shape up against each other?

Leinsters pack was excellent; the lineout was mostly very good, & they had the majority of the scrums.

Byrne isn't Sexton obviously, & when you slot him into a back line that was used to Sexton, his positioning & cadence breaks a backline that worked before, until everyone gets realigned. For me, Byrne sits too deep, & that means everyone else gets less time, & for this match it meant backs getting the ball standing still & with two world class players in their grill along with the ball.

I wasn't even vaguely optimistic about this match. Its one thing to take on France, it's another to take on France with DuPont; & that was the job today, & the difference between Leinster winning & losing.

I was hoping from a Connacht perspective that Leinster would win, & we'd be facing a hungover Leinster; now they've be fucking angry, & we're going to get absolutely reamed.

Regarding Byrne, I think he has been treated a bit unfairly to be honest. He was replacing an Irish legend and whether it was to make him feel better, or Irish rugby to feel better, was talked up quite a bit beyond his current ability.

He’s a decent player and looks to have the skills to get even better, but some of the pressure piled on him by people taking him up has, I think, been unfair

Yeah, it's deja vu all over again as a wise man once said

I've seen it happen with ROG taking over from Humphreys, with Sexton taking over from Contepomi etc, etc, etc

It's a massive change to bring in a new pivot, & there's no easy way to do it, because unless you clone the bloody player*, everyone outside the pivot will have to adjust; & the nature of professional sports is that the new guy doesn't get nearly enough time before he becomes the dude.

* This is why it's on the one hand odd, but maybe also beneficial that Sam Prendergast might be off to Connacht, because when you look at him play, he is a clone of Sexton ! He's just a year or two too young to ask to be the guy for Leinster

Jim Lahey wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 9:02 pm No longer have a login to Planet Rugby. How are the Leinster chaps taking it?

Didn't see the match but seeing a lot of blame being directed at Byrne for being hopeless, and Cullen for his shite selection policy. How did the packs shape up against each other?

Mild, resigned and rational disappointment for some, anger for others that they were a bit headless and kept turning down 3.

By the point Toulouse started turning the screw, for me, Leinster should've been ahead. They'd plenty of chances. Byrne sadly was an empty shirt attacking their defence and got most joy from picking a pass and some average up and unders. Good at what he does well but not enough for a Euro final.

Defences cancelled each other out, Leinster came close but mucked up the final pass, Toulouse made shite of the Leinster ruck, patiently building a score and never seemed to tire. If anything they got stronger in extra time. Very impressive.

lemonhead wrote: ↑Sun May 26, 2024 6:29 am

Jim Lahey wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 9:02 pm No longer have a login to Planet Rugby. How are the Leinster chaps taking it?

Didn't see the match but seeing a lot of blame being directed at Byrne for being hopeless, and Cullen for his shite selection policy. How did the packs shape up against each other?

Mild, resigned and rational disappointment for some, anger for others that they were a bit headless and kept turning down 3.

By the point Toulouse started turning the screw, for me, Leinster should've been ahead. They'd plenty of chances. Byrne sadly was an empty shirt attacking their defence and got most joy from picking a pass and some average up and unders. Good at what he does well but not enough for a Euro final.

Defences cancelled each other out, Leinster came close but mucked up the final pass, Toulouse made shite of the Leinster ruck, patiently building a score and never seemed to tire. If anything they got stronger in extra time. Very impressive.

He was rather unremarkable at ail level and couldn't get ahead of a bloke that spent his last season walking on the pitch.

I don't know how Leinster can expect him to do something when plan a fails.

Clearly been trying to get his brother to take over, but he's still fairly ropey over 80mins.

My feel is Prendergast and Frawley need more time in there. Too many 10s and while none are good enough yet, some have far more long term potential and need backing. There'll be some pain in doing so but that Ross comfort blanket has probably hit and bounced off its ceiling.

lemonhead wrote: ↑Sun May 26, 2024 6:29 am Byrne sadly was an empty shirt attacking their defence and got most joy from picking a pass and some average up and unders. Good at what he does well but not enough for a Euro final.

The up and unders were a massive +ve for Leinster as Toulouse coughed them up all match long: grant I can't recall how many were from Byrne.

They dominated that part of the game along with the scrum although much of that was down to Porter's illegal technique being waived on by the officials.

Was genuinely surprised at that. The worse his garryowens got, the more panicky Toulouse dealt with them.

It's not a plus column thing for me though, any half decent backfield returns those with interest.

Torquemada 1420 wrote: ↑Sun May 26, 2024 7:03 am

lemonhead wrote: ↑Sun May 26, 2024 6:29 am Byrne sadly was an empty shirt attacking their defence and got most joy from picking a pass and some average up and unders. Good at what he does well but not enough for a Euro final.

The up and unders were a massive +ve for Leinster as Toulouse coughed them up all match long: grant I can't recall how many were from Byrne.

They dominated that part of the game along with the scrum although much of that was down to Porter's illegal technique being waived on by the officials.

Porter is only ever effective when he scrums illegally

And then he folded under presssure a number of times right in front of Mr. Carley - who ignored it.

Propping is all about what you can get away with, in that respect Porter is a brilliant scrummager.

I resent inept refereeing determining matches

Tichtheid wrote: ↑Sun May 26, 2024 8:00 am Propping is all about what you can get away with, in that respect Porter is a brilliant scrummager.

It's quite incredible that he does though. The way he folds in, leaving the tighthead with no shoulder to scrum against is so bloody obvious to anyone that has the faintest idea of what's going on. It's also bloody dangerous.

Blackmac wrote: ↑Sun May 26, 2024 9:16 am

Tichtheid wrote: ↑Sun May 26, 2024 8:00 am Propping is all about what you can get away with, in that respect Porter is a brilliant scrummager.

It's quite incredible that he does though. The way he folds in, leaving the tighthead with no shoulder to scrum against is so bloody obvious to anyone that has the faintest idea of what's going on. It's also bloody dangerous.

I completely agree, I find it incredible that some props just keep getting away with it, but they do.

Lads Byrne isn't some new signing that needs time to bed in. He's been in the setup for years and has now led Leinster through the business end of two European campaigns. He's a very good OH 90% of the time, and would do a great job for/against 90% of teams.

However for those teams that want to be the best, of which Leinster are most certainly one, he's just not good enough.

I can't remember which game its was earlier this year that Frawley started at ten and he was like Sexton reborn. Playing flat, making half breaks and offloading, putting runners through gaps - masterful display that had me giddy as a schoolgirl. Now there's a fuck ton of caveats that go with that - it was one game, pack were dominating and the next week when he also started at ten he was fairly ordinary. However there is definitely enough there to justify giving him a prolonged run at ten to see if he can nail it down.

Neither Byrne is good enough to lead Leinster full time, Prendergast is still a slight kid (and more hope than substance) and we've seen fuck all of Tector. Give Frawley a run!

lemonhead wrote: ↑Sun May 26, 2024 6:46 am Clearly been trying to get his brother to take over, but he's still fairly ropey over 80mins.

My feel is Prendergast and Frawley need more time in there. Too many 10s and while none are good enough yet, some have far more long term potential and need backing. There'll be some pain in doing so but that Ross comfort blanket has probably hit and bounced off its ceiling.

Agree, and if Frawley was less injury prone I'd imagine he'd be the one in the 10 shirt.
There are too many 10s, and you can't keep swapping them expecting any of them to really click with the team. But Prendergast has shown too much to lose him to Connacht for 2 years.

If any of them could do with the trip it'd be the Byrne brothers. Highly unlikely Ross would go with the move, but for Harry it might mean a lot of time at 10. Shame to lose him, and I'd definitely have a go at Leo for not developing the 10s more properly.

Ulster are crying out for a 10, as are Connacht, and Leinster have 5 viable options.

But the lattes aren't as good as they are in D4 in Belfast or Galway, plus the lads would be too far away from their mammies to do their washing, so don't see it happening.

Prendercast is a good youngsters. Should step up.

The French teams look pretty good this season. That Aussie neatly spoiled it for them.

Monk wrote: ↑Sun May 26, 2024 8:17 am I resent inept refereeing determining matches

Luckily tat non try by Leinster didn't matter

Jim Lahey wrote: ↑Sun May 26, 2024 11:28 am Ulster are crying out for a 10, as are Connacht, and Leinster have 5 viable options.

But the lattes aren't as good as they are in D4 in Belfast or Galway, plus the lads would be too far away from their mammies to do their washing, so don't see it happening.

Dunno. Munster were awash with 10's not so long ago and the bulk of them were/are not good enough for anything beyond URC duty. Suspect that the lack of gametime for contenders has masked deficiencies for some of the Leinster 10's. Cullen needs to pick a horse and back them.

In a related note, the Irish rugby sub reddit is wild. Multiple threads going on about the Byrne's dad being a senior exec at a sponsor.

Blackmac wrote: ↑Sun May 26, 2024 9:16 am

Tichtheid wrote: ↑Sun May 26, 2024 8:00 am Propping is all about what you can get away with, in that respect Porter is a brilliant scrummager.

It's quite incredible that he does though. The way he folds in, leaving the tighthead with no shoulder to scrum against is so bloody obvious to anyone that has the faintest idea of what's going on. It's also bloody dangerous.

I think he's been a bit hard done by at international level but that last scrum penalty he won for Leinster was a very bad example of what he's doing.

Slick wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 10:19 pm

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 9:13 pm

Jim Lahey wrote: ↑Sat May 25, 2024 9:02 pm No longer have a login to Planet Rugby. How are the Leinster chaps taking it?

Didn't see the match but seeing a lot of blame being directed at Byrne for being hopeless, and Cullen for his shite selection policy. How did the packs shape up against each other?

Leinsters pack was excellent; the lineout was mostly very good, & they had the majority of the scrums.

Byrne isn't Sexton obviously, & when you slot him into a back line that was used to Sexton, his positioning & cadence breaks a backline that worked before, until everyone gets realigned. For me, Byrne sits too deep, & that means everyone else gets less time, & for this match it meant backs getting the ball standing still & with two world class players in their grill along with the ball.

I wasn't even vaguely optimistic about this match. Its one thing to take on France, it's another to take on France with DuPont; & that was the job today, & the difference between Leinster winning & losing.

I was hoping from a Connacht perspective that Leinster would win, & we'd be facing a hungover Leinster; now they've be fucking angry, & we're going to get absolutely reamed.

Regarding Byrne, I think he has been treated a bit unfairly to be honest. He was replacing an Irish legend and whether it was to make him feel better, or Irish rugby to feel better, was talked up quite a bit beyond his current ability.

He’s a decent player and looks to have the skills to get even better, but some of the pressure piled on him by people taking him up has, I think, been unfair

He's 29, not exactly some whippersnapper. He's not going to improve at this stage. His brother is 25. Time running out for him. I like Frawley but he 27 now and has never had a consistent run at 10.

How is it possible for some sources to have Jack Willis with 41 tackles made (ITV) and others 29 made and 2 missed (ESPN and Rugbypass)?

topofthemoon wrote: ↑Sun May 26, 2024 6:13 pm How is it possible for some sources to have Jack Willis with 41 tackles made (ITV) and others 29 made and 2 missed (ESPN and Rugbypass)?

Double tackles can be handled differently

JM2K6 wrote: ↑Sun May 26, 2024 10:40 pm

topofthemoon wrote: ↑Sun May 26, 2024 6:13 pm How is it possible for some sources to have Jack Willis with 41 tackles made (ITV) and others 29 made and 2 missed (ESPN and Rugbypass)?

Double tackles can be handled differently

Pffft. Schalk Burger made 43 tackles in just 80 minutes.

JM2K6 wrote: ↑Sun May 26, 2024 10:40 pm

topofthemoon wrote: ↑Sun May 26, 2024 6:13 pm How is it possible for some sources to have Jack Willis with 41 tackles made (ITV) and others 29 made and 2 missed (ESPN and Rugbypass)?

Double tackles can be handled differently

Yeah, it must be something along those lines but don't often see this kind of big difference though. I'm pretty sure ESPN switched from only counting one tackler per tackle a number of years ago - Test match stats from the early 2010s for example have much lower tackle counts. There's a big jump somewhere in the mid-2010s on ESPN Scrum stats pages.