NPR

Posted: **Sun Aug 16, 2020 3:31 pm**

Has Biggar ever taken a ref decision without mouthing off?

Hal Jordan wrote: ↑Sun Aug 16, 2020 3:29 pm A backrow with Lawes at 6 is struggling at the breakdown? I'm shocked, shocked I tell you!

With a bit of luck the new approach to enforcing breakdown laws might see the end of locks in the back row.

Posted: **Sun Aug 16, 2020 3:32 pm**

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Sun Aug 16, 2020 3:31 pm
Hal Jordan wrote: ↑Sun Aug 16, 2020 3:29 pm A backrow with Lawes at 6 is struggling at the breakdown? I'm shocked, shocked I tell you!
With a bit of luck the new approach to enforcing breakdown laws might see the end of locks in the back row.

He was ineffective under the old approach...

Posted: **Sun Aug 16, 2020 3:32 pm**

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Sun Aug 16, 2020 3:31 pm Has Biggar ever taken a ref decision without mouthing off?

Hal Jordan wrote: ↑Sun Aug 16, 2020 3:29 pm A backrow with Lawes at 6 is struggling at the breakdown? I'm shocked, shocked I tell you!
With a bit of luck the new approach to enforcing breakdown laws might see the end of locks in the back row.

With Ludlam and Harrison you could in theory allow for a Lawes in the backrow in terms of breakdown duty. However, that's against a normal team, against a side like Wasps, I don't see why you'd risk it.

Posted: **Sun Aug 16, 2020 3:34 pm**

Hal Jordan wrote: ↑Sun Aug 16, 2020 3:32 pm
sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Sun Aug 16, 2020 3:31 pm
Hal Jordan wrote: ↑Sun Aug 16, 2020 3:29 pm A backrow with Lawes at 6 is struggling at the breakdown? I'm shocked, shocked I tell you!
With a bit of luck the new approach to enforcing breakdown laws might see the end of locks in the back row.
He was ineffective under the old approach...

Oh I know, ranted about it plenty in the past, but it might be magnified to an a sufficient extent that coaches finally call time on it unless they've got no choice.

Posted: **Sun Aug 16, 2020 3:36 pm**

Braindead.

Going one handed so rarely pays off.

Posted: **Sun Aug 16, 2020 3:36 pm**

Sopoaga is lucky he doesn't get paid by the minute played.

Posted: **Sun Aug 16, 2020 3:37 pm**

If he doesn't do that we lose 7 points,, as opposed to just chancing what goes on.

Posted: **Sun Aug 16, 2020 3:38 pm**

Raggs wrote: ↑Sun Aug 16, 2020 3:37 pm If he doesn't do that we lose 7 points,, as opposed to just chancing what goes on.

But we spend the next 10 with 15 players trying to correct it instead of 14.

Whether genuinely going for an intercept or not leading with one hand like that is incredibly risky.

Posted: **Sun Aug 16, 2020 3:42 pm**

That's a ridiculously harsh penalty.

Posted: **Sun Aug 16, 2020 3:51 pm**

Brilliant pickup and sashay from Young.

Posted: **Sun Aug 16, 2020 4:01 pm**

Same old Saints, some lovely rugby but ultimately disappointment.

Posted: **Sun Aug 16, 2020 4:12 pm**

Kawazaki wrote: ↑Sun Aug 16, 2020 3:29 pm How on earth did Furbank get capped?

He's no Alex Goode that's for sure.

Posted: **Sun Aug 16, 2020 4:24 pm**

That game was markedly higher quality than the others I watched.

Posted: **Sun Aug 16, 2020 6:03 pm**

Nols wrote: ↑Sun Aug 16, 2020 4:24 pm That game was markedly higher quality than the others I watched.

Yep, best game of the weekend
Wasps well deserved winners.
Far too many errors from Saints

Posted: **Mon Aug 17, 2020 6:51 pm**

LI sign Dan Norton on a short term deal. Had been training/on trial with us for the last month or two.

Posted: **Wed Aug 19, 2020 6:30 am**

Formalised player welfare guidance for the remainder of the season and into next. Confirms no player can start 3 games in a week etc

Posted: **Wed Aug 19, 2020 10:37 am**

I don't love there's talk about the need to manage workload when that could mean so many things, but it's tricky when clubs/players can cite a need for some work as being preventative of injury

Posted: **Wed Aug 19, 2020 10:55 am**

Jack Clifford forced to retire due to injury.

Posted: **Wed Aug 19, 2020 11:08 am**

tc27 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 19, 2020 10:55 am Jack Clifford forced to retire due to injury.

Ah, bollocks!! Had some tough times injury wise.
https://www.therugbypaper.co.uk/domest ... re-at-27/

Posted: **Wed Aug 19, 2020 11:13 am**

Yes, he was one of those players that just seemed to go from one injury to the next, poor fellow.

Posted: **Wed Aug 19, 2020 11:22 am**

Some players just have bodies that don't agree with modern rugby. Poor sod, he was a real talent.

Posted: **Wed Aug 19, 2020 11:28 am**

Real shame

Looked on another level at that JWC and clearly impressed Eddie before the injuries took over.

Posted: **Wed Aug 19, 2020 1:06 pm**

Margin__Walker wrote: ↑Mon Aug 17, 2020 6:51 pm LI sign Dan Norton on a short term deal. Had been training/on trial with us for the last month or two.

A 32-year old 7s specialist.

Might as well give Usain Bolt a deal.

Posted: **Wed Aug 19, 2020 1:59 pm**

Kawazaki wrote: ↑Wed Aug 19, 2020 1:06 pm
Margin__Walker wrote: ↑Mon Aug 17, 2020 6:51 pm LI sign Dan Norton on a short term deal. Had been training/on trial with us for the last month or two.

A 32-year old 7s specialist.

Might as well give Usain Bolt a deal.

Normally I'd look at the Irish tight five and agree. But right now teams are going to have to back up multiple games a week on pitches that (today's weather aside) could be rather firmer than the norm. If there's ever going to be a time a 7s player might find more of the space to bring their skills to the fore it's now

Posted: **Wed Aug 19, 2020 2:17 pm**

Kawazaki wrote: ↑Wed Aug 19, 2020 1:06 pm
Margin__Walker wrote: ↑Mon Aug 17, 2020 6:51 pm LI sign Dan Norton on a short term deal. Had been training/on trial with us for the last month or two.

A 32-year old 7s specialist.

Might as well give Usain Bolt a deal.

He's got a contract for a couple of months as injury cover. Likely pretty cheap, given the 7s programme implosion. It's pretty low risk and he'll probably get a game or two at most. He may even do okay

Posted: **Wed Aug 19, 2020 2:45 pm**

Margin__Walker wrote: ↑Wed Aug 19, 2020 2:17 pm
Kawazaki wrote: ↑Wed Aug 19, 2020 1:06 pm
Margin__Walker wrote: ↑Mon Aug 17, 2020 6:51 pm LI sign Dan Norton on a short term deal. Had been training/on trial with us for the last month or two.

A 32-year old 7s specialist.

Might as well give Usain Bolt a deal.
He's got a contract for a couple of months as injury cover. Likely pretty cheap, given the 7s programme implosion. It's pretty low risk and he'll probably get a game or two at most. He may even do okay

This ringing endorsement was brought to you by the Optimist Party.

Posted: **Wed Aug 19, 2020 2:51 pm**

Injury cover is rarely world class.

Posted: **Thu Aug 20, 2020 10:19 am**

JP Doyle's been made redundant. A shame - though I think he's not been on top of his game for a while, he's clearly good enough for the Premiership.

Posted: **Thu Aug 20, 2020 10:28 am**

JM2K6 wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 10:19 am JP Doyle's been made redundant. A shame - though I think he's not been on top of his game for a while, he's clearly good enough for the Premiership.

He's not been great recently, certainly wouldn't prefer to see his name over numerous others. Add to that the fact he's probably on the biggest salary, and it's perhaps not a surprise. If he was still one of the best, sure, but he's mid table at best now.

Posted: **Thu Aug 20, 2020 12:26 pm**

Raggs wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 10:28 am
JM2K6 wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 10:19 am JP Doyle's been made redundant. A shame - though I think he's not been on top of his game for a while, he's clearly good enough for the Premiership.
He's not been great recently, certainly wouldn't prefer to see his name over numerous others. Add to that the fact he's probably on the biggest salary, and it's perhaps not a surprise. If he was still one of the best, sure, but he's mid table at best now.

Still a bit of a shock mind you. Just how much will the RFU save by making him redundant?

Posted: **Thu Aug 20, 2020 12:47 pm**

Ian Tempest better not still have a job if JP's gone (however much he might have slipped below his best).

Posted: **Thu Aug 20, 2020 12:51 pm**

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 12:47 pm Ian Tempest better not still have a job if JP's gone (however much he might have slipped below his best).

There are a few that I'd rate as being below JP in terms of feel for the game and empathy (if that makes sense?). There's a couple that cause me to groan out loud when I see that they're reffing.

Did Doyle have a couple of shockers earlier in the season or am I imagining that?

Posted: **Thu Aug 20, 2020 3:46 pm**

JM2K6 wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 10:19 am JP Doyle's been made redundant. A shame - though I think he's not been on top of his game for a while, he's clearly good enough for the Premiership.

I'd prefer English refs given a chance to develop in the top English league just like I prefer English players to play ahead of the 42% of non-EQP players named across all 12/13 squads. Perhaps the RFU felt the same way.

Posted: **Thu Aug 20, 2020 5:04 pm**

That makes absolutely no sense at all, Toga. In that analogy, JP is "EQP" as he's an RFU representative.

Posted: **Thu Aug 20, 2020 6:00 pm**

Warriors vs. Wasps tomorrow:

Wasps: 15 Rob Miller, 14 Paolo Odogwu, 13 Michael Le Bourgeois, 12 Ryan Mills, 11 Marcus Watson, 10 Lima Sopoaga, 9 Ben Vellacott, 8 Tom Willis, 7 Gabriel Oghre, 6 Ben Morris, 5 James Gaskell (c), 4 Tim Cardall, 3 Biyi Alo, 2 Tom Cruse, 1 Simon McIntyre
Replacements: 16 Alfie Barbeary, 17 Tom West, 18 Jeff Toomaga-Allen, 19 Theo Vukasinovic, 20 Sione Vailanu, 21 Sam Wolstenholme, 22 Jacob Umaga, 23 Matteo Minozzi

Worcester: 15 Chris Pennell, 14 Noah Heward, 13 Francois Venter, 12 Will Butler (c), 11 Nick David, 10 Duncan Weir, 9 Gareth Simpson, 8 Cornell du Preez, 7 Tom Dodd, 6 GJ van Velze, 5 Andrew Kitchener, 4 James Scott, 3 Richard Palframan, 2 Beck Cutting, 1 Callum Black
Replacements: 16 Isaac Miller, 17 Lewis Holsey, 18 Joe Morris, 19 Justin Clegg, 20 Caleb Montgomery, 21 Jono Kitto, 22 Jamie Shillcock, 23 Oli Morris

Date: Friday, August 21
Venue: Ricoh Arena
Kick-off: 19:45 BST (18:45 GMT)
Referee: Craig Maxwell-Keys
Assistant referees: Adam Leal, Rob Warburton
TMO: Keith Lewis

Not a single starter remains the same from Sunday's game for Wasps, which makes sense after a 5 day turn around and knowing that the next fixtur ewill be coming up fast. Slightly concerned about that back row, I know he's highly rated, but I don't feel like I've seen much from Tom Willis at Prem level yet, Oghre's normally a hooker and Morris is a fine squad player, but not much else. A significant step down from Willis, Young and Shields.

Bench doesn't contain much in the way of star power to rescue things if it's all going a bit awry, just Umaga and Minozzi. Hopefully we won't need it, our record against Worcester in recent years is very good.

As an aside to any Falcons fans on bored, thank you for Zach Kibirige. Why didn't he get more opportunities up there? He's been great for us so far.

Posted: **Thu Aug 20, 2020 6:03 pm**

Kawazaki wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 3:46 pm
JM2K6 wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 10:19 am JP Doyle's been made redundant. A shame - though I think he's not been on top of his game for a while, he's clearly good enough for the Premiership.

I'd prefer English refs given a chance to develop in the top English league just like I prefer English players to play ahead of the 42% of non-EQP players named across all 12/13 squads. Perhaps the RFU felt the same way.

Holy xenophobia, Batman! What in the fuck is this nonsense? Aside from the fact that JP is the ref equivalent of EQP, why would ref nationality matter in the way it does for players?

Posted: **Thu Aug 20, 2020 6:37 pm**

I always thought JP was OK, certainly not the worst ref in terms of letting the game flow

Posted: **Thu Aug 20, 2020 7:42 pm**

JM2K6 wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 5:04 pm That makes absolutely no sense at all, Toga. In that analogy, JP is "EQP" as he's an RFU representative.

So presumably he could/has refereed an IRB/WR internationally sanctioned match involving Ireland?

It's got nothing to do with xenophobia either before the woke awaken. It's simply about making the English Premiership a catalyst for English rugby, be that playing or officiating. Every other country does it better, even the French clubs are getting more French nowadays. Sale have 8 current/former Springboks in their first-choice XV now. Saracens only had six at their 'worst' 'Saffercens' era plus a Namibian although two of those six (Botha/Barritt) played for England and a third (Joubert) declared for England but wasn't picked. No chance of that dividend with Sale.

Posted: **Thu Aug 20, 2020 8:16 pm**

Whatever point you think your're making about players (and I doubt you'll find many besides Steve Diamond that think the Saffer influx up North is a good thing) is completely irrelevant to refs.

There is literally no negative impact upon the development of English rugby by having non-English refs, nor any positive impact by having exclusively English ones. The only reason to eschew them is xenophobia, however much the word might trigger your snowflakey little mind.

Posted: **Thu Aug 20, 2020 8:41 pm**

Tell us what you know about the refereeing development pyramid in England? How it works. CPD, assessment, review etc.

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