NPR

Hands up - will stop defending Faz over Ford for a bit. Was very poor today

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Sat Feb 06, 2021 6:40 pm There’s not a single positive to that. The worst performance by an England side with talent I can remember

This for me is what grates in particular - plenty of talent in that squad (though not all starting or in the right positions).

Ah well. Was spared having to sit through that in the end. Was busy earlier, but have diligently stayed away from social media etc, to watch this evening. Went on the ITV app and got the result blown by the title of the file.

Sounded like a shocker, so glad I've not wasted my evening watching it.

Some absolute wastes of space out there today. The gamble on players who haven't played for ages based on form from a year ago backfired horribly, it's obscene that Farrell played the full 80 when giving such a cancerous performance, the tactical approach was nothing short of disgusting, and I'm glad the Scots won. Eddie's anti-rugby approach leads to teams that are afraid of the fucking ball and terrified of the opposition. Absolute bollocks.

tc27 wrote: ↑Sat Feb 06, 2021 7:01 pm

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Sat Feb 06, 2021 6:40 pm There’s not a single positive to that. The worst performance by an England side with talent I can remember

This for me is what grates in particular - plenty of talent in that squad (though not all starting or in the right positions).

Yeah if this was Sean Perry stuff I’d feel differently. This is a good side and should do better

On BBC 5Live before the match, Jones justified his tactics by saying that the greatest game ever played, Barbarians vs New Zealand 1973, had a monster amount of kicks (103?). Funny how everyone remembers the kicks from that game, they get played so many times in highlight reels, don't they, Eddie?

Did Lawrence actually get the ball in attack until just before he got hauled off so that Ford could play 12 and keep Captain Fantastic shitting the bed at 10 like a man in the last throes of fatal dysentery?

Hal Jordan wrote: ↑Sat Feb 06, 2021 8:22 pm On BBC 5Live before the match, Jones justified his tactics by saying that the greatest game ever played, Barbarians vs New Zealand 1973, had a monster amount of kicks (103?). Funny how everyone remembers the kicks from that game, they get played so many times in highlight reels, don't they, Eddie?

Did Lawrence actually get the ball in attack until just before he got hauled off so that Ford could play 12 and keep Captain Fantastic shitting the bed at 10 like a man in the last throes of fatal dysentery?

His one and only offensive touch came at that point.

Farrell at 10

Even allowing for a gameplan where he's been told to kick that was a shitty performance. Quite timely given Squidge's video about Ford and a bunch of mouth breathers coming out with "He's not even the best 10 in England/The Premiership" and proclaiming Farrell to be the world's best instead.

tc27 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 07, 2021 9:41 am

I said a few bad words at this one

tc27 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 07, 2021 9:41 am

And that's during the yellow card period where we really should be able to get around them ball in hand.

tc27 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 07, 2021 9:41 am

Jesus wept that is bad.

Can somebody please shoot Eddie Jones into the sun.

So, Italy up next, fantasy changes I would make to the team, none of which I expect to happen.

LCD in for George
Ribbans in the second row alongside Itoje
Willis in for Wilson
Anybody in for Billy V, heck I'd even go back to Tom Wood at 8
Even though he shat the bed, Robson to start, Randall on the bench
Ford at 10, Smith on the bench
Malins at 15

Oxbow wrote: ↑Sun Feb 07, 2021 10:35 am So, Italy up next, fantasy changes I would make to the team, none of which I expect to happen.

LCD in for George
Ribbans in the second row alongside Itoje
Willis in for Wilson
Anybody in for Billy V, heck I'd even go back to Tom Wood at 8
Even though he shat the bed, Robson to start, Randall on the bench
Ford at 10, Smith on the bench
Malins at 15

Before any of that I'd sack Eddie Jones.

Oxbow wrote: ↑Sun Feb 07, 2021 10:35 am So, Italy up next, fantasy changes I would make to the team, none of which I expect to happen.

LCD in for George
Ribbans in the second row alongside Itoje
Willis in for Wilson
Anybody in for Billy V, heck I'd even go back to Tom Wood at 8
Even though he shat the bed, Robson to start, Randall on the bench
Ford at 10, Smith on the bench
Malins at 15

I'd love to see a back row of Willis, Curry and Earl.

tc27 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 07, 2021 9:41 am

I only watched highlights but that reminds me of one moment in it. From the lineout at 5:40, Youngs makes a good break into the 22, Itoje picks and gets on the front foot. I think Slade has a great opportunity on the left with Scotland reorganizing themselves and some mismatches. Two English backs aren't in position yet but I reckon if Slade was up flatter and had a go, they’d be able to support. But he’s just directing traffic and not even paying attention.

Yet what they do go with is a high pass directly at Billy who doesn't look like he wants it.

That tw@tter picture is terrible. I wonder if Farrell or others will look at that and cringe or just write it off as typical media sniping.

Oxbow wrote: ↑Sun Feb 07, 2021 10:35 am So, Italy up next, fantasy changes I would make to the team, none of which I expect to happen.

LCD in for George
Ribbans in the second row alongside Itoje
Willis in for Wilson
Anybody in for Billy V, heck I'd even go back to Tom Wood at 8
Even though he shat the bed, Robson to start, Randall on the bench
Ford at 10, Smith on the bench
Malins at 15

Lol, that trophy. Didn't see it properly at first.

I know it's a long shot but if England stick to the same script and Italy can hold their catches this could be their best chance ever. Keep running it back at England, no need to get the try (cus they can't seem to do that) and wait for the inevitable penalties.

Italy’s best chance to beat us was early in Lancaster’s time in the snow in Rome, think a Chargedown Charlie was the difference IIRC.
Let’s not get too dramatic, we thumped them in the autumn playing no rugby at all

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Sun Feb 07, 2021 1:21 pm Italy’s best chance to beat us was early in Lancaster’s time in the snow in Rome, think a Chargedown Charlie was the difference IIRC.
Let’s not get too dramatic, we thumped them in the autumn playing no rugby at all

The 2010 game was pretty dire and I remember feeling relieved by the win, then baffled while ol' Scabnose insisted during the post-match interview that England had put in a great performance.

In fact looking on wiki, there's a few games in the not too distant past where Italy finished uncomfortably close:
'08 23 - 19
'10 17 - 12
'12 19 - 15
'13 18 - 11

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Sun Feb 07, 2021 1:29 pm

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Sun Feb 07, 2021 1:21 pm Italy’s best chance to beat us was early in Lancaster’s time in the snow in Rome, think a Chargedown Charlie was the difference IIRC.
Let’s not get too dramatic, we thumped them in the autumn playing no rugby at all

The 2010 game was pretty dire and I remember feeling relieved by the win, then baffled while ol' Scabnose insisted during the post-match interview that England had put in a great performance.

In fact looking on wiki, there's a few games in the not too distant past where Italy finished uncomfortably close:
'08 23 - 19
'10 17 - 12
'12 19 - 15
'13 18 - 11

I was at the 13 game at Twickers, it didn’t feel as close as the scoreline suggested. More just dross from both sides on a cold day.
Is the ‘08 game the one where BCM had the famous meltdown in the commentary box?

Same pack but Willis over Wilson.

Ford for Farrell, Robson start, Randall bench, odogwu for slade and malins for Daly.

Raggs wrote: ↑Sun Feb 07, 2021 1:35 pm Same pack but Willis over Wilson.

Ford for Farrell, Robson start, Randall bench, odogwu for slade and malins for Daly.

Why would you have Billy amywhere near that team? Can anyone name the last good game he had in an England shirt?

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Sun Feb 07, 2021 1:33 pm

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Sun Feb 07, 2021 1:29 pm

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Sun Feb 07, 2021 1:21 pm Italy’s best chance to beat us was early in Lancaster’s time in the snow in Rome, think a Chargedown Charlie was the difference IIRC.
Let’s not get too dramatic, we thumped them in the autumn playing no rugby at all

The 2010 game was pretty dire and I remember feeling relieved by the win, then baffled while ol' Scabnose insisted during the post-match interview that England had put in a great performance.

In fact looking on wiki, there's a few games in the not too distant past where Italy finished uncomfortably close:
'08 23 - 19
'10 17 - 12
'12 19 - 15
'13 18 - 11

I was at the 13 game at Twickers, it didn’t feel as close as the scoreline suggested. More just dross from both sides on a cold day.
Is the ‘08 game the one where BCM had the famous meltdown in the commentary box?

Good memory, it is indeed.

ASMO wrote: ↑Sun Feb 07, 2021 1:40 pm

Raggs wrote: ↑Sun Feb 07, 2021 1:35 pm Same pack but Willis over Wilson.

Ford for Farrell, Robson start, Randall bench, odogwu for slade and malins for Daly.

Why would you have Billy amywhere near that team? Can anyone name the last good game he had in an England shirt?

I'd keep Wilson but shift him to 8 and bring in Willis at 6.

Curry to 8 with Earl and Willis on the flanks

ASMO wrote: ↑Sun Feb 07, 2021 1:46 pm Curry to 8 with Earl and Willis on the flanks

I'm still not anti Billy but actually let's go with those 3.

ASMO wrote: ↑Sun Feb 07, 2021 1:46 pm Curry to 8 with Earl and Willis on the flanks

EJ says not a chance!!

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Sun Feb 07, 2021 1:42 pm

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Sun Feb 07, 2021 1:33 pm

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Sun Feb 07, 2021 1:29 pm
The 2010 game was pretty dire and I remember feeling relieved by the win, then baffled while ol' Scabnose insisted during the post-match interview that England had put in a great performance.

In fact looking on wiki, there's a few games in the not too distant past where Italy finished uncomfortably close:
'08 23 - 19
'10 17 - 12
'12 19 - 15
'13 18 - 11

I was at the 13 game at Twickers, it didn’t feel as close as the scoreline suggested. More just dross from both sides on a cold day.
Is the ‘08 game the one where BCM had the famous meltdown in the commentary box?

Good memory, it is indeed.

BCM having a meltdown because a dumbass fly-half kicked away good possession? Isn't it great that doesn't happen any more.

I thought it was referring to the Balshaw clown incident, but now I remember the white hot rage and barely avoided cursing.

Here it is.

Nike Swoosh kit so thats late OOs?

Fantastic. I sometimes wonder if Italy’s decline in results has some connection to Stadio Flaminio closing, could be a bit of a cauldron

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Sun Feb 07, 2021 3:56 pm Fantastic. I sometimes wonder if Italy’s decline in results has some connection to Stadio Flaminio closing, could be a bit of a cauldron

Fabulous place to watch rugby
The porchetta rolls and beer stops on the way from the city centre

SaintK wrote: ↑Sun Feb 07, 2021 3:57 pm

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Sun Feb 07, 2021 3:56 pm Fantastic. I sometimes wonder if Italy’s decline in results has some connection to Stadio Flaminio closing, could be a bit of a cauldron

Fabulous place to watch rugby
The porchetta rolls and beer stops on the way from the city centre

The Stadio Olimpico is a bit of a faff to get to but is still a good day out. Had a great weekend there a couple of years ago

Mate of mine is good friends with one of the England analysts.
Evidently EJ and his coaches spent 10 hours yesterday going through the England performance against Scotland
FFS most of us watching could have told him what was wrong 20 minutes into the first half
I meant to ask if team selection was mentioned at all during that 10 hours

SaintK wrote: ↑Mon Feb 08, 2021 10:30 am Mate of mine is good friends with one of the England analysts.
Evidently EJ and his coaches spent 10 hours yesterday going through the England performance against Scotland
FFS most of us watching could have told him what was wrong 20 minutes into the first half
I meant to ask if team selection was mentioned at all during that 10 hours

<rewinds>

"OK, maybe THIS time Farrell will pass to teammates in space instead of kicking it straight to a Scot"

"Nope, okay."

<rewinds>

"OK, maybe THIS time..."

JM2K6 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 08, 2021 11:16 am

SaintK wrote: ↑Mon Feb 08, 2021 10:30 am Mate of mine is good friends with one of the England analysts.
Evidently EJ and his coaches spent 10 hours yesterday going through the England performance against Scotland
FFS most of us watching could have told him what was wrong 20 minutes into the first half
I meant to ask if team selection was mentioned at all during that 10 hours

<rewinds>

"OK, maybe THIS time Farrell will pass to teammates in space instead of kicking it straight to a Scot"

"Nope, okay."

<rewinds>

"OK, maybe THIS time..."

Eddie, we've rewatched this 100 times, and despite not having a single scot in front of them to block them, our players still didn't line up with Farrell for the best chance to chase, and still didn't chase hard enough.

Raggs wrote: ↑Mon Feb 08, 2021 11:17 am

JM2K6 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 08, 2021 11:16 am

SaintK wrote: ↑Mon Feb 08, 2021 10:30 am Mate of mine is good friends with one of the England analysts.
Evidently EJ and his coaches spent 10 hours yesterday going through the England performance against Scotland
FFS most of us watching could have told him what was wrong 20 minutes into the first half
I meant to ask if team selection was mentioned at all during that 10 hours

<rewinds>

"OK, maybe THIS time Farrell will pass to teammates in space instead of kicking it straight to a Scot"

"Nope, okay."

<rewinds>

"OK, maybe THIS time..."

Eddie, we've rewatched this 100 times, and despite not having a single scot in front of them to block them, our players still didn't line up with Farrell for the best chance to chase, and still didn't chase hard enough.

Oh yes. It seems very obvious to me that this sort of thing will be used to criticise the players for not executing the strategy properly, rather than bothering to examine whether the strategy and the system are in fact a tactical cul-de-sac made worse by dismal selection decisions.

I imagine that the discussion went

"Just a blip, give 'em a chance to redeem themselves against Italy."
"Same team again then, Eddie?"
"Yep. Now someone give me a statistic about box kicking so I can feed it to the Press."

Hal Jordan wrote: ↑Mon Feb 08, 2021 11:19 am I imagine that the discussion went

"Just a blip, give 'em a chance to redeem themselves against Italy."
"Same team again then, Eddie?"
"Yep. Now someone give me a statistic about box kicking so I can feed it to the Press."

I fear this will be it!!!