NPR

New conference in a bit

Who's next into the hotseat, I wonder.

#jacindalite

Will the super injunction be lifted and her trans partner be outed?

C69 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 12:43 pm Will the super injunction be lifted and her trans partner be outed?

If there was one I doubt it. As someone with no love at all for her.

1. Who cares. She has a right to a private life.

2. She and her husband have enough money for a £100k+ loan to be insignificant to their finances to a point she "forgot" when her husband made it.

3. She will have enough lawyer friends where they'd provide help to keep it up.

4. See point 1.

C69 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 12:43 pm Will the super injunction be lifted and her trans partner be outed?

It's about the worst kept secret in Holyrood and I'm fairly certain that no ever suggested a trans partner.

Blackmac wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 3:09 pm

C69 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 12:43 pm Will the super injunction be lifted and her trans partner be outed?

It's about the worst kept secret in Holyrood and I'm fairly certain that no ever suggested a trans partner.

Yeah, I thought it was about a female partner?

Yes I know her partner isn't trans. Her name is very well known, I just thought it added to the thread.

C69 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 4:52 pm Yes I know her partner isn't trans. Her name is very well known, I just thought it added to the thread.

It didn't and to be honest shouldn't be used to "add to" anything other than in the correct context.

Big D wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 4:59 pm

C69 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 4:52 pm Yes I know her partner isn't trans. Her name is very well known, I just thought it added to the thread.

It didn't and to be honest shouldn't be used to "add to" anything other than in the correct context.

I disagree especially when the trans issue brought her down.
Her speach earlier referrenced her or she being her successsor as well.
Self ID has been a major contributory factor in her demise.

C69 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 6:24 pm

Big D wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 4:59 pm

C69 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 4:52 pm Yes I know her partner isn't trans. Her name is very well known, I just thought it added to the thread.

It didn't and to be honest shouldn't be used to "add to" anything other than in the correct context.

I disagree especially when the trans issue brought her down.
Her speach earlier referrenced her or she being her successsor as well.
Self ID has been a major contributory factor in her demise.

Eh?

C69 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 6:24 pm

Big D wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 4:59 pm

C69 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 4:52 pm Yes I know her partner isn't trans. Her name is very well known, I just thought it added to the thread.

It didn't and to be honest shouldn't be used to "add to" anything other than in the correct context.

I disagree especially when the trans issue brought her down.
Her speach earlier referrenced her or she being her successsor as well.
Self ID has been a major contributory factor in her demise.

Nothing brought her down, she resigned out of the blue.

spike wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 7:06 pm

C69 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 6:24 pm

Big D wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 4:59 pm

It didn't and to be honest shouldn't be used to "add to" anything other than in the correct context.

I disagree especially when the trans issue brought her down.
Her speach earlier referrenced her or she being her successsor as well.
Self ID has been a major contributory factor in her demise.

Nothing brought her down, she resigned out of the blue.

That’s a generous reading of the situation. Although I agree it certainly wasn’t just the trans issue, there was a mountain of other stuff

C69 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 6:24 pm

Big D wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 4:59 pm

C69 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 4:52 pm Yes I know her partner isn't trans. Her name is very well known, I just thought it added to the thread.

It didn't and to be honest shouldn't be used to "add to" anything other than in the correct context.

I disagree especially when the trans issue brought her down.
Her speach earlier referrenced her or she being her successsor as well.
Self ID has been a major contributory factor in her demise.

It isn't a major factor though. It is one of many factors. In the eyes of her party, the complete failure will be the stagnation of progress on independence issue. Yougov polls from early December and January show an 11% swing back to "no" with a lead of 6%. In that time there has been

There are a number of issues that have contributed to this, as well as plain old fatigue in a role she was groomed for. In no particular order:
Lack of independence progress.
The feeling that she is desperate for independence at all costs during a cost of living crisis.
Failure to meet promises on the dualling of the A9, a notoriously dangerous road. Only 11 miles have been completed. This is probably the most recent issue.
The ferry fiasco.
Her husbands loan to the SNP
Her memory over Salmond being investigated.
Handling of the GR bill, rightly or wrongly.
The named person scheme, rightly or wrongly.
Allegations over missing funds
The teacher strikes
Not really closing the attainment gap in schools.

Even if we don't believe she is resigning purely for personal reasons, no one of the above has been the "major" factor. There is always something that is the straw that breaks the camels back. It doesn't mean it was the heaviest straw.

She has also failed her party now by not bringing through obvious candidates to replace her.

She has been and will continue to be a good communicator, but I am not sure she has been a good politician. It is the former, and the hope of independence, that has continually got her good approval ratings, even now they are still decent.

Slick wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 7:17 pm

spike wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 7:06 pm

C69 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 6:24 pm

I disagree especially when the trans issue brought her down.
Her speach earlier referrenced her or she being her successsor as well.
Self ID has been a major contributory factor in her demise.

Nothing brought her down, she resigned out of the blue.

That’s a generous reading of the situation. Although I agree it certainly wasn’t just the trans issue, there was a mountain of other stuff

Yes there were multiple issues, but non which would have threatened her leadership, she could have stayed as long she wanted given the SNP vote (assuming theres no fraud issue).

spike wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 7:52 pm

Slick wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 7:17 pm

spike wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 7:06 pm

Nothing brought her down, she resigned out of the blue.

That’s a generous reading of the situation. Although I agree it certainly wasn’t just the trans issue, there was a mountain of other stuff

Yes there were multiple issues, but non which would have threatened her leadership, she could have stayed as long she wanted given the SNP vote (assuming theres no fraud issue).

Yup, fair enough, that’s true.

Although I guess the other point is that all those issues SHOULD have threatened her leadership in any normal party/country

Slick wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 7:54 pm

spike wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 7:52 pm

Slick wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 7:17 pm

That’s a generous reading of the situation. Although I agree it certainly wasn’t just the trans issue, there was a mountain of other stuff

Yes there were multiple issues, but non which would have threatened her leadership, she could have stayed as long she wanted given the SNP vote (assuming theres no fraud issue).

Yup, fair enough, that’s true.

Although I guess the other point is that all those issues SHOULD have threatened her leadership in any normal party/country

I've seen rumours that are hard to believe that the Stewart
McDonald emails may be dynamite but I highly doubt that.

Big D wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 11:08 pm

Slick wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 7:54 pm

spike wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 7:52 pm

Yes there were multiple issues, but non which would have threatened her leadership, she could have stayed as long she wanted given the SNP vote (assuming theres no fraud issue).

Yup, fair enough, that’s true.

Although I guess the other point is that all those issues SHOULD have threatened her leadership in any normal party/country

I've seen rumours that are hard to believe that the Stewart
McDonald emails may be dynamite but I highly doubt that.

Murray seems to think so but it's impossible to work that lad out at the moment, he appears aggrieved at everyone.

Slick wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 7:54 pm

spike wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 7:52 pm

Slick wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 7:17 pm

That’s a generous reading of the situation. Although I agree it certainly wasn’t just the trans issue, there was a mountain of other stuff

Yes there were multiple issues, but non which would have threatened her leadership, she could have stayed as long she wanted given the SNP vote (assuming theres no fraud issue).

Yup, fair enough, that’s true.

Although I guess the other point is that all those issues SHOULD have threatened her leadership in any normal party/country

I am not sure that these issues are the sort which should have threatened her leadership, they tend to get blown up in the small world of Scottish politics with many latched onto by the FM detractors looking for ammo. I would have thought issues like taking millions of £s of Russian money into Party Funds and continuing to do so after the start of the Ukranian Invasion, making an ex KGB agents son a Lord of the Realm despite official advice otherwise, deliberately suppressing the Russian Report, getting FNPs for breaking your own laws re Covid lock down, partying hard during lock down before the Queens funeral, spending £37b on a failed TT&T system, £billions lost to fraud on PPE procurement, PPE VIP lane and Troy fraud, having your Party Chairman step down for dodgy tax avoidance/evasion, having a non-dom wife who doesn't pay tax in her country of residence, having your rivers and beaches covered in shit, etc etc are far more serious issues that should have led to immediate sackings/stepping down of a PM or FM. If every FM/PM was to step down due to public sector strikes, procurement problems, road improvement schemes not going ahead as quickly as promised or some new legislation being controversial then we would need a new FM/PM every week! I think we need to get things into proportion and measure all our politicians by the same metrics.

Sorry, dpedin, but that last line is hilarious

C69 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 4:52 pm Yes I know her partner isn't trans. Her name is very well known, I just thought it added to the thread.

I heard it was Andy Murray’s mum yesterday from someone who knows Nicola’s hairdresser!

dpedin wrote: ↑Thu Feb 16, 2023 8:07 am

Slick wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 7:54 pm

spike wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 7:52 pm

Yes there were multiple issues, but non which would have threatened her leadership, she could have stayed as long she wanted given the SNP vote (assuming theres no fraud issue).

Yup, fair enough, that’s true.

Although I guess the other point is that all those issues SHOULD have threatened her leadership in any normal party/country

I am not sure that these issues are the sort which should have threatened her leadership, they tend to get blown up in the small world of Scottish politics with many latched onto by the FM detractors looking for ammo. I would have thought issues like taking millions of £s of Russian money into Party Funds and continuing to do so after the start of the Ukranian Invasion, making an ex KGB agents son a Lord of the Realm despite official advice otherwise, deliberately suppressing the Russian Report, getting FNPs for breaking your own laws re Covid lock down, partying hard during lock down before the Queens funeral, spending £37b on a failed TT&T system, £billions lost to fraud on PPE procurement, PPE VIP lane and Troy fraud, having your Party Chairman step down for dodgy tax avoidance/evasion, having a non-dom wife who doesn't pay tax in her country of residence, having your rivers and beaches covered in shit, etc etc are far more serious issues that should have led to immediate sackings/stepping down of a PM or FM. If every FM/PM was to step down due to public sector strikes, procurement problems, road improvement schemes not going ahead as quickly as promised or some new legislation being controversial then we would need a new FM/PM every week! I think we need to get things into proportion and measure all our politicians by the same metrics.

It's a bit of a cop out saying that you can set aside looking at the SNP's record because the some other party in a different parliament is shit.

Slick wrote: ↑Thu Feb 16, 2023 8:49 am Sorry, dpedin, but that last line is hilarious

I get the point dpedin is making though i would use standards rather than metrics. Sturgeon has to meet higher standards (as does starmer) than the Tory party equivalents. The frequency and extent of the shit emerging from the Tory party vastly exceeds that of the SNP and that should matter. The whataboutery of the right wing press does allow for lower standards to be applied to the likes of Johnson.

dpedin wrote: ↑Thu Feb 16, 2023 8:07 am

Slick wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 7:54 pm

spike wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 7:52 pm

Yes there were multiple issues, but non which would have threatened her leadership, she could have stayed as long she wanted given the SNP vote (assuming theres no fraud issue).

Yup, fair enough, that’s true.

Although I guess the other point is that all those issues SHOULD have threatened her leadership in any normal party/country

I am not sure that these issues are the sort which should have threatened her leadership, they tend to get blown up in the small world of Scottish politics with many latched onto by the FM detractors looking for ammo. I would have thought issues like taking millions of £s of Russian money into Party Funds and continuing to do so after the start of the Ukranian Invasion, making an ex KGB agents son a Lord of the Realm despite official advice otherwise, deliberately suppressing the Russian Report, getting FNPs for breaking your own laws re Covid lock down, partying hard during lock down before the Queens funeral, spending £37b on a failed TT&T system, £billions lost to fraud on PPE procurement, PPE VIP lane and Troy fraud, having your Party Chairman step down for dodgy tax avoidance/evasion, having a non-dom wife who doesn't pay tax in her country of residence, having your rivers and beaches covered in shit, etc etc are far more serious issues that should have led to immediate sackings/stepping down of a PM or FM. If every FM/PM was to step down due to public sector strikes, procurement problems, road improvement schemes not going ahead as quickly as promised or some new legislation being controversial then we would need a new FM/PM every week! I think we need to get things into proportion and measure all our politicians by the same metrics.

We are continually told an independent Scotland would be a better and more prosperous place. Holding our politicians to a level of less worse than Westminster rather than good doesn't give a lot of confidence and doesn't mean they are governing well.

Big D wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 7:29 pm

C69 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 6:24 pm

Big D wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 4:59 pm

It didn't and to be honest shouldn't be used to "add to" anything other than in the correct context.

I disagree especially when the trans issue brought her down.
Her speach earlier referrenced her or she being her successsor as well.
Self ID has been a major contributory factor in her demise.

It isn't a major factor though. It is one of many factors. In the eyes of her party, the complete failure will be the stagnation of progress on independence issue. Yougov polls from early December and January show an 11% swing back to "no" with a lead of 6%. In that time there has been

There are a number of issues that have contributed to this, as well as plain old fatigue in a role she was groomed for. In no particular order:
Lack of independence progress.
The feeling that she is desperate for independence at all costs during a cost of living crisis.
Failure to meet promises on the dualling of the A9, a notoriously dangerous road. Only 11 miles have been completed. This is probably the most recent issue.
The ferry fiasco.
Her husbands loan to the SNP
Her memory over Salmond being investigated.
Handling of the GR bill, rightly or wrongly.
The named person scheme, rightly or wrongly.
Allegations over missing funds
The teacher strikes
Not really closing the attainment gap in schools.

Even if we don't believe she is resigning purely for personal reasons, no one of the above has been the "major" factor. There is always something that is the straw that breaks the camels back. It doesn't mean it was the heaviest straw.

She has also failed her party now by not bringing through obvious candidates to replace her.

She has been and will continue to be a good communicator, but I am not sure she has been a good politician. It is the former, and the hope of independence, that has continually got her good approval ratings, even now they are still decent.

You can likely add the deposit scheme to that too. It genuninely feels of late like a reverse midas touch - everything that Nicola/Scot Govt touches turns into an unholy mess.

robmatic wrote: ↑Thu Feb 16, 2023 9:44 am

dpedin wrote: ↑Thu Feb 16, 2023 8:07 am

Slick wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 7:54 pm

Yup, fair enough, that’s true.

Although I guess the other point is that all those issues SHOULD have threatened her leadership in any normal party/country

I am not sure that these issues are the sort which should have threatened her leadership, they tend to get blown up in the small world of Scottish politics with many latched onto by the FM detractors looking for ammo. I would have thought issues like taking millions of £s of Russian money into Party Funds and continuing to do so after the start of the Ukranian Invasion, making an ex KGB agents son a Lord of the Realm despite official advice otherwise, deliberately suppressing the Russian Report, getting FNPs for breaking your own laws re Covid lock down, partying hard during lock down before the Queens funeral, spending £37b on a failed TT&T system, £billions lost to fraud on PPE procurement, PPE VIP lane and Troy fraud, having your Party Chairman step down for dodgy tax avoidance/evasion, having a non-dom wife who doesn't pay tax in her country of residence, having your rivers and beaches covered in shit, etc etc are far more serious issues that should have led to immediate sackings/stepping down of a PM or FM. If every FM/PM was to step down due to public sector strikes, procurement problems, road improvement schemes not going ahead as quickly as promised or some new legislation being controversial then we would need a new FM/PM every week! I think we need to get things into proportion and measure all our politicians by the same metrics.

It's a bit of a cop out saying that you can set aside looking at the SNP's record because the some other party in a different parliament is shit.

I don't think that was the point being made. I read that as saying the things that are meant to be scandalous for the Scottish government would barely register on the scale of corruption and incompetence shown by the tories.

Biffer wrote: ↑Thu Feb 16, 2023 11:11 am

robmatic wrote: ↑Thu Feb 16, 2023 9:44 am

dpedin wrote: ↑Thu Feb 16, 2023 8:07 am

I am not sure that these issues are the sort which should have threatened her leadership, they tend to get blown up in the small world of Scottish politics with many latched onto by the FM detractors looking for ammo. I would have thought issues like taking millions of £s of Russian money into Party Funds and continuing to do so after the start of the Ukranian Invasion, making an ex KGB agents son a Lord of the Realm despite official advice otherwise, deliberately suppressing the Russian Report, getting FNPs for breaking your own laws re Covid lock down, partying hard during lock down before the Queens funeral, spending £37b on a failed TT&T system, £billions lost to fraud on PPE procurement, PPE VIP lane and Troy fraud, having your Party Chairman step down for dodgy tax avoidance/evasion, having a non-dom wife who doesn't pay tax in her country of residence, having your rivers and beaches covered in shit, etc etc are far more serious issues that should have led to immediate sackings/stepping down of a PM or FM. If every FM/PM was to step down due to public sector strikes, procurement problems, road improvement schemes not going ahead as quickly as promised or some new legislation being controversial then we would need a new FM/PM every week! I think we need to get things into proportion and measure all our politicians by the same metrics.

It's a bit of a cop out saying that you can set aside looking at the SNP's record because the some other party in a different parliament is shit.

I don't think that was the point being made. I read that as saying the things that are meant to be scandalous for the Scottish government would barely register on the scale of corruption and incompetence shown by the tories.

... and that was my point! I am not setting aside any of the SNPs or FM's record but trying to put it into perspective and avoid the usual repeating of the Scottish editions of the Daily Heil/Naziexpress blowing up issues out of all proportion because of their obvious dislike of FM/SNP and Independence. For example we constantly hear that the NHS in Scotland is failing and it is true that it is under real pressure and should be performing better but it is the best performing of any of the 4 nations on many metrics ie A&E wait times. We also have more beds, nurses, doctors, GPs, etc per head. Sure it can and should be a lot better but given resources are ultimately fixed by the UK Gov under the Barnett formula the room to manoeuvre for any Scottish Gov is limited.

Every Gov will have problems, things will never go right or as planned. However the scale of the issues being presented as problems in Scotland for which the FM should have resigned for, and I agree they are real concerns, pale into insignificance when compared to the crooked malevolence and incompetence displayed by the current Tory Gov.

Procurement of the ferries in Scotland and the subsequent take over has been a mess, no one would suggest otherwise, however compared to the MoD procurement of the £5.5 billion Ajax tank procurement any ferries overspend is almost a rounding error. Yet no-one his suggesting the UK Gov and PM should resign because of this fiasco. The overspend on the ferries is probably much less than has been spent on the ridiculous feasibility studies for the Blonde Bumblecunts Garden Bridge, Thames Estuary Airport, Yacht Britannia and the tunnel/bridge between NI and Scotland! The current PM when Chancellor had to write of £billions of bad debts as a result of his covid response for businesses, fraud was rampant and millions was handed out to dodgy companies who disappeared, yet he got promote to PM on the basis of being 'good with numbers'.

Who knows what may come to light in the future as to why Wee Nic resigned, there may well be serious issues, but the 'issues' which Big D listed as reasons for FM to resign and to which I responded are serious but hardly enough to warrant calling for the FM's head! As I said above if every Gov was held to account for not delivering on planned road improvements we would have a new Gov every week!

In a sane world they probably would represent serious questions being asked over that person's suitability for FM, that's the point. Don't let the equivalent of the Overton window being shifted change that.

Wylie Coyote wrote: ↑Thu Feb 16, 2023 10:27 am

Big D wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 7:29 pm

C69 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 6:24 pm

I disagree especially when the trans issue brought her down.
Her speach earlier referrenced her or she being her successsor as well.
Self ID has been a major contributory factor in her demise.

It isn't a major factor though. It is one of many factors. In the eyes of her party, the complete failure will be the stagnation of progress on independence issue. Yougov polls from early December and January show an 11% swing back to "no" with a lead of 6%. In that time there has been

There are a number of issues that have contributed to this, as well as plain old fatigue in a role she was groomed for. In no particular order:
Lack of independence progress.
The feeling that she is desperate for independence at all costs during a cost of living crisis.
Failure to meet promises on the dualling of the A9, a notoriously dangerous road. Only 11 miles have been completed. This is probably the most recent issue.
The ferry fiasco.
Her husbands loan to the SNP
Her memory over Salmond being investigated.
Handling of the GR bill, rightly or wrongly.
The named person scheme, rightly or wrongly.
Allegations over missing funds
The teacher strikes
Not really closing the attainment gap in schools.

Even if we don't believe she is resigning purely for personal reasons, no one of the above has been the "major" factor. There is always something that is the straw that breaks the camels back. It doesn't mean it was the heaviest straw.

She has also failed her party now by not bringing through obvious candidates to replace her.

She has been and will continue to be a good communicator, but I am not sure she has been a good politician. It is the former, and the hope of independence, that has continually got her good approval ratings, even now they are still decent.

You can likely add the deposit scheme to that too. It genuninely feels of late like a reverse midas touch - everything that Nicola/Scot Govt touches turns into an unholy mess.

The deposit scheme is heading for a catastrophic disaster. It's going to cost the Scottish economy a fortune, is pretty much unworkable for small businesses and the suggestion is there might be a reduction of 40% to 50%
in the choice of goods on the shelf. It doesn't help that the person in charge, replies "I dunno" to questions about it.

I see alll the Unionist pig dogs and bootlickers are desperate to write her obituary.
It is like they don't know what narrative to go with, was she the reincarnation of Hitler and Pol Pot or Ted Bundy or Ed Gein.
Sheila Foggerty earlier was really letting herself down.

Think this may actually wake Scotland up and make them even more desperate to get independence.
They were too comfy for the campaign for independence go on and on and on.
When fine leaders like her just say enough, and walk away, what they are really doing is putting a clock on it and hopefully waking people up to the urgency of what they believe in.

Line6 HXFX wrote: ↑Fri Feb 17, 2023 9:04 am I see alll the Unionist pig dogs and bootlickers are desperate to write her obituary.
It is like they don't know what narrative to go with, was she the reincarnation of Hitler and Pol Pot or Ted Bundy or Ed Gein.
Sheila Foggerty earlier was really letting herself down.

Think this may actually wake Scotland up and make them even more desperate to get independence.
They were too comfy for the campaign for independence go on and on and on.
When fine leaders like her just say enough, and walk away, what they are really doing is putting a clock on it and hopefully waking people up to the urgency of what they believe in.

It really is a mystery why the most recent poll shows independence less popular than it was in 2014.

Wylie Coyote wrote: ↑Fri Feb 17, 2023 9:19 am

Line6 HXFX wrote: ↑Fri Feb 17, 2023 9:04 am I see alll the Unionist pig dogs and bootlickers are desperate to write her obituary.
It is like they don't know what narrative to go with, was she the reincarnation of Hitler and Pol Pot or Ted Bundy or Ed Gein.
Sheila Foggerty earlier was really letting herself down.

Think this may actually wake Scotland up and make them even more desperate to get independence.
They were too comfy for the campaign for independence go on and on and on.
When fine leaders like her just say enough, and walk away, what they are really doing is putting a clock on it and hopefully waking people up to the urgency of what they believe in.

It really is a mystery why the most recent poll shows independence less popular than it was in 2014.

Where are people getting this less popular thing from? So far as I can tell it’s from one poll, from an organisation which doesn’t conform to the standards of the British association of polling companies standards, and it’s run by that famously neutral figure Lord Ashcroft. If pro Indy folk continually pointed to one poll with that kind of backing theyd be laughed out of town.

Biffer wrote: ↑Fri Feb 17, 2023 10:24 am

Wylie Coyote wrote: ↑Fri Feb 17, 2023 9:19 am

Line6 HXFX wrote: ↑Fri Feb 17, 2023 9:04 am I see alll the Unionist pig dogs and bootlickers are desperate to write her obituary.
It is like they don't know what narrative to go with, was she the reincarnation of Hitler and Pol Pot or Ted Bundy or Ed Gein.
Sheila Foggerty earlier was really letting herself down.

Think this may actually wake Scotland up and make them even more desperate to get independence.
They were too comfy for the campaign for independence go on and on and on.
When fine leaders like her just say enough, and walk away, what they are really doing is putting a clock on it and hopefully waking people up to the urgency of what they believe in.

It really is a mystery why the most recent poll shows independence less popular than it was in 2014.

Where are people getting this less popular thing from? So far as I can tell it’s from one poll, from an organisation which doesn’t conform to the standards of the British association of polling companies standards, and it’s run by that famously neutral figure Lord Ashcroft. If pro Indy folk continually pointed to one poll with that kind of backing theyd be laughed out of town.

To be fair the most recent three yougov polls showed an 13% swing from 1st (early Dec) to 3rd (mid Feb).

I don't tend to put much trust in opinion polls anyway.

Big D wrote: ↑Thu Feb 16, 2023 10:26 am

dpedin wrote: ↑Thu Feb 16, 2023 8:07 am

Slick wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 7:54 pm

Yup, fair enough, that’s true.

Although I guess the other point is that all those issues SHOULD have threatened her leadership in any normal party/country

I am not sure that these issues are the sort which should have threatened her leadership, they tend to get blown up in the small world of Scottish politics with many latched onto by the FM detractors looking for ammo. I would have thought issues like taking millions of £s of Russian money into Party Funds and continuing to do so after the start of the Ukranian Invasion, making an ex KGB agents son a Lord of the Realm despite official advice otherwise, deliberately suppressing the Russian Report, getting FNPs for breaking your own laws re Covid lock down, partying hard during lock down before the Queens funeral, spending £37b on a failed TT&T system, £billions lost to fraud on PPE procurement, PPE VIP lane and Troy fraud, having your Party Chairman step down for dodgy tax avoidance/evasion, having a non-dom wife who doesn't pay tax in her country of residence, having your rivers and beaches covered in shit, etc etc are far more serious issues that should have led to immediate sackings/stepping down of a PM or FM. If every FM/PM was to step down due to public sector strikes, procurement problems, road improvement schemes not going ahead as quickly as promised or some new legislation being controversial then we would need a new FM/PM every week! I think we need to get things into proportion and measure all our politicians by the same metrics.

We are continually told an independent Scotland would be a better and more prosperous place. Holding our politicians to a level of less worse than Westminster rather than good doesn't give a lot of confidence and doesn't mean they are governing well.

"Less worse than England " seems to be a common yardstick for them. NHS, Policing etc, abysmal but less worse than England.

Blackmac wrote: ↑Sat Feb 18, 2023 9:49 am

Big D wrote: ↑Thu Feb 16, 2023 10:26 am

dpedin wrote: ↑Thu Feb 16, 2023 8:07 am

I am not sure that these issues are the sort which should have threatened her leadership, they tend to get blown up in the small world of Scottish politics with many latched onto by the FM detractors looking for ammo. I would have thought issues like taking millions of £s of Russian money into Party Funds and continuing to do so after the start of the Ukranian Invasion, making an ex KGB agents son a Lord of the Realm despite official advice otherwise, deliberately suppressing the Russian Report, getting FNPs for breaking your own laws re Covid lock down, partying hard during lock down before the Queens funeral, spending £37b on a failed TT&T system, £billions lost to fraud on PPE procurement, PPE VIP lane and Troy fraud, having your Party Chairman step down for dodgy tax avoidance/evasion, having a non-dom wife who doesn't pay tax in her country of residence, having your rivers and beaches covered in shit, etc etc are far more serious issues that should have led to immediate sackings/stepping down of a PM or FM. If every FM/PM was to step down due to public sector strikes, procurement problems, road improvement schemes not going ahead as quickly as promised or some new legislation being controversial then we would need a new FM/PM every week! I think we need to get things into proportion and measure all our politicians by the same metrics.

We are continually told an independent Scotland would be a better and more prosperous place. Holding our politicians to a level of less worse than Westminster rather than good doesn't give a lot of confidence and doesn't mean they are governing well.

"Less worse than England " seems to be a common yardstick for them. NHS, Policing etc, abysmal but less worse than England.

But there are many people who seem to want us to follow the same path as England. So 'better than RUK' is ultimately the yardstick if we gain independence. Because it was the alternative.

Biffer wrote: ↑Sat Feb 18, 2023 10:15 am

Blackmac wrote: ↑Sat Feb 18, 2023 9:49 am

Big D wrote: ↑Thu Feb 16, 2023 10:26 am

We are continually told an independent Scotland would be a better and more prosperous place. Holding our politicians to a level of less worse than Westminster rather than good doesn't give a lot of confidence and doesn't mean they are governing well.

"Less worse than England " seems to be a common yardstick for them. NHS, Policing etc, abysmal but less worse than England.

But there are many people who seem to want us to follow the same path as England. So 'better than RUK' is ultimately the yardstick if we gain independence. Because it was the alternative.

I don't think that's enough for a lot of people though. Being second worst, if there is a big economic cost, isn't an improvement many would value. Independence at the moment is seen as a huge risk and a dramatic step, so unless we are aiming to be "as good as" some of the better nations, I don't think it's a compelling argument.

I also think it's ridiculous to suggest that anyone against independence wants to follow England. That is simply not the case. The biggest problem is that despite having the most incompetent and unpopular UK government in decades, they have completely failed to make the case that they have the right policies and right people to make an independent Scotland any better.

Blackmac wrote: ↑Sat Feb 18, 2023 10:58 am

Biffer wrote: ↑Sat Feb 18, 2023 10:15 am

Blackmac wrote: ↑Sat Feb 18, 2023 9:49 am

"Less worse than England " seems to be a common yardstick for them. NHS, Policing etc, abysmal but less worse than England.

But there are many people who seem to want us to follow the same path as England. So 'better than RUK' is ultimately the yardstick if we gain independence. Because it was the alternative.

I don't think that's enough for a lot of people though. Being second worst, if there is a big economic cost, isn't an improvement many would value. Independence at the moment is seen as a huge risk and a dramatic step, so unless we are aiming to be "as good as" some of the better nations, I don't think it's a compelling argument.

I don’t either, but the initial comparisons will always have a part of that because we’re coming from the same original base. Independence allows us to get to a position where we can compare ourselves to smaller countries like Denmark, Norway, Netherlands etc. but the initial comparisons will be about what’s different to the rest of the uk.

robmatic wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 4:45 pm

Blackmac wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 3:09 pm

C69 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 12:43 pm Will the super injunction be lifted and her trans partner be outed?

It's about the worst kept secret in Holyrood and I'm fairly certain that no ever suggested a trans partner.

Yeah, I thought it was about a female partner?

Wha?

Uncle fester wrote: ↑Sat Feb 18, 2023 6:58 pm

robmatic wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 4:45 pm

Blackmac wrote: ↑Wed Feb 15, 2023 3:09 pm

It's about the worst kept secret in Holyrood and I'm fairly certain that no ever suggested a trans partner.

Yeah, I thought it was about a female partner?

Wha?

She likes scissorsing I guess?