Stop voting for fucking Tories

[Hal Jordan]

It would be interesting to see the Instructions to Counsel which the nation has paid for.

[sturginho]

Still better than the UK where we get a daily helping of bullshit to swallow

https://www.theguardian.com/environment ... rm-insects

[fishfoodie]

Still better than the UK where we get a daily helping of bullshit to swallow

https://www.theguardian.com/environment ... rm-insects

Fiore said he and his team concocted a formula that combines locally farmed mopane worms with cereals and fruits that do not need to be imported – a significant benefit as the war in Ukraine and the strong US dollar make foreign-grown foods increasingly inaccessible.

Although unwilling to disclose his recipe before the publication of the study’s data, Fiore did say his insect-based porridge contained grains including sorghum and millets. He said he was sure the dish was palatable, with his research team having conducted consumer taste tests in Scotland, a country long associated with porridge.

.... a country long associated with deep fried mars bars.

Still, the bugs do look more appetizing that your average KFC meal

[JM2K6]

Naturally the Heil and Excess claiming this proves that the inquiry is "anti-democratic" and a "witchhunt"

Lord Pannick QC, who has form, he wrote a legal opinion for beloved entrepreneur and noted taxpayer Philip Green to challenge the Parliamentary enquiry into BHS.

However, in counterbalance he also represented Gina Miller twice in her judicial reviews, so he's definitely able to set his personal principles aside for the client.

But all this really is is another in the long list of the Tory Party and Johnson in particular throwing shit to try and either escape scrutiny or delegitimise unfavourable findings in the eyes of the public.

Johnson is a fucking blight on politics, public life and basic human decency.

Pannick has offered an opinion, the Privileges committee progressing the issue received a legal opinion which stands at odds with the Pannick position. And both positions should be considered apart from whether one happens to like Boris and whether on the matter at hand one thinks he intentionally lied and lied and lied or you're clinically insane and think Boris has some sort of defence

How much a legal position even matters for what isn't a legal process I don't know. Parliament has retained the right to treat such situations seemingly as political considerations, i.e. it's a parliamentary process and not a court one

Myself I think he's a rancid liar and you wouldn't piss on him if he was on fire, I'm not sure if they can do much when I think the standard isn't did he lie and more did he hinder parliament. Given I think he wouldn't know the truth anymore than know his children I'd be hard pressed to consider parliament was hindered by his obvious BS

https://davidallengreen.com/2022/09/the ... arliament/

The Opinion is not strong.

Indeed, it relies entirely on the “but for” device, which can be one of the deftest rhetorical tactics for any advocate.

The colour of a thing would be black, but for it being white.

The object would be cheese, but for it being chalk.

And here:

“But for Parliamentary privilege, a court hearing a judicial review application brought by Mr Johnson would declare the Committee’s Report to be unlawful.”

There are a few points to make about this Opinion.

To begin with, the inquiry into whether Boris Johnson misled the House of Commons is a matter for Parliament and not the courts.

And Parliament is in charge of its own procedures which, as a matter of basic constitutional principle (and the Bill of Rights), cannot be gainsaid by the courts.

So to say “but for” this being a parliamentary matter it would have this judicial consequence is to disregard perhaps the most fundamental part of our constitutional arrangements.

[fishfoodie]

Well I hope you UK taxpayers are happy with what the Tories got with your £129,700 !

[Rhubarb & Custard]

Well I hope you UK taxpayers are happy with what the Tories got with your £129,700 !

They'll have no issues with the coffee makers if they match that level of funding for legal aid and whatnot

[Rhubarb & Custard]

Lord Pannick QC, who has form, he wrote a legal opinion for beloved entrepreneur and noted taxpayer Philip Green to challenge the Parliamentary enquiry into BHS.

However, in counterbalance he also represented Gina Miller twice in her judicial reviews, so he's definitely able to set his personal principles aside for the client.

But all this really is is another in the long list of the Tory Party and Johnson in particular throwing shit to try and either escape scrutiny or delegitimise unfavourable findings in the eyes of the public.

Johnson is a fucking blight on politics, public life and basic human decency.

Pannick has offered an opinion, the Privileges committee progressing the issue received a legal opinion which stands at odds with the Pannick position. And both positions should be considered apart from whether one happens to like Boris and whether on the matter at hand one thinks he intentionally lied and lied and lied or you're clinically insane and think Boris has some sort of defence

How much a legal position even matters for what isn't a legal process I don't know. Parliament has retained the right to treat such situations seemingly as political considerations, i.e. it's a parliamentary process and not a court one

Myself I think he's a rancid liar and you wouldn't piss on him if he was on fire, I'm not sure if they can do much when I think the standard isn't did he lie and more did he hinder parliament. Given I think he wouldn't know the truth anymore than know his children I'd be hard pressed to consider parliament was hindered by his obvious BS

https://davidallengreen.com/2022/09/the ... arliament/

The Opinion is not strong.

Indeed, it relies entirely on the “but for” device, which can be one of the deftest rhetorical tactics for any advocate.

The colour of a thing would be black, but for it being white.

The object would be cheese, but for it being chalk.

And here:

“But for Parliamentary privilege, a court hearing a judicial review application brought by Mr Johnson would declare the Committee’s Report to be unlawful.”

There are a few points to make about this Opinion.

To begin with, the inquiry into whether Boris Johnson misled the House of Commons is a matter for Parliament and not the courts.

And Parliament is in charge of its own procedures which, as a matter of basic constitutional principle (and the Bill of Rights), cannot be gainsaid by the courts.

So to say “but for” this being a parliamentary matter it would have this judicial consequence is to disregard perhaps the most fundamental part of our constitutional arrangements.

If people don't like the opinion that's fine, myself I've not read either of them and arguably wouldn't understand the legalese anyway, even before it's a parliamentary procedure not a legal one. I did hear Gina Miller earlier defending Pannick on the grounds he's being attacked because people don't like who he's perceiving as defending and yet his quality of work speaks for itself and we shouldn't pick and choose depending on circumstances how we want processes to apply

[Tichtheid]

I don't think it's any kind of revelation that lawyers can act on behalf of decent people, reprehensible people and all points in between.

I think the point is that Johnson was ousted by 50+ of his own ministers resigning due to lack of confidence in him, that has never happened before in the history of the UK, unless anyone knows differently.

This story is an attempt at a rewrite, don't be fooled again.

[tabascoboy]

Looks like this is all another step to the "re-invention" of Boris after the revelation that the candidates for leadership are so inept

[SaintK]

Nice little £20k thankyou present for Dr Fox!

Tory MP Liam Fox received a £20,000 donation in June from a Covid testing firm on whose behalf he had contacted the then health secretary Matt Hancock.
Mr Fox recommended SureScreen Diagnostics to Mr Hancock in 2020, an email seen by campaign group Good Law Project and the BBC shows.
The company went on to win a £500m contract to provide tests without facing competition.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-62766148

[Rhubarb & Custard]

Nice little £20k thankyou present for Dr Fox!

Tory MP Liam Fox received a £20,000 donation in June from a Covid testing firm on whose behalf he had contacted the then health secretary Matt Hancock.
Mr Fox recommended SureScreen Diagnostics to Mr Hancock in 2020, an email seen by campaign group Good Law Project and the BBC shows.
The company went on to win a £500m contract to provide tests without facing competition.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-62766148

That will be disgraced former defence secretary Liam Fox if you please.

And it says something, if also nothing good, that someone with as atrociously corrupt behaviour behind them as disgraced former defence secretary Liam Fox that they've been able to continue a high profile career in politics following his appalling abrogation of duty

[tabascoboy]

Well who couldn't have guessed this was coming...

The article of course is paywalled, but the things hinted at are mostly concerning protections such as the 48-hour working week, entitlement to holiday and paid holidays, breaks during work, working conditions...

[Insane_Homer]

[Hal Jordan]

Well who couldn't have guessed this was coming...

The article of course is paywalled, but the things hinted at are mostly concerning protections such as the 48-hour working week, entitlement to holiday and paid holidays, breaks during work, working conditions...

Truss isn't eyeing anything up. It's the dark money cunts that back her that are priapic for post-Brexit sovereignty, allowing them to feast on the NHS, sack off the Working Time Directive and TUPE, throw as many H&S regulations outside window as they can, plus the Net Zero Watch scum, and the avoidance of EU money laundering regs.

Truss is just another Johnson, a distraction machine to focus away from the vile shit going on behind the scenes, but without his animal cunning and utter belief in himself.

[I like neeps]

Well who couldn't have guessed this was coming...

The article of course is paywalled, but the things hinted at are mostly concerning protections such as the 48-hour working week, entitlement to holiday and paid holidays, breaks during work, working conditions...

Truss isn't eyeing anything up. It's the dark money cunts that back her that are priapic for post-Brexit sovereignty, allowing them to feast on the NHS, sack off the Working Time Directive and TUPE, throw as many H&S regulations outside window as they can, plus the Net Zero Watch scum, and the avoidance of EU money laundering regs.

Truss is just another Johnson, a distraction machine to focus away from the vile shit going on behind the scenes, but without his animal cunning and utter belief in himself.

The problem with Truss is she believes workers should have less rights. The problem for Truss is the electorate don't believe that. See also, windfall tax on oil producers.

She will lose an election if she takes away holiday rights and the new labour governments first act? Restoring those holiday rights.

[fishfoodie]

The problem with Truss is she believes workers should have less rights. The problem for Truss is the electorate don't believe that. See also, windfall tax on oil producers.

She will lose an election if she takes away holiday rights and the new labour governments first act? Restoring those holiday rights.

I'm almost surprised it took her this long to threaten the GE next year.

The only problem is that I don't think even this intake of Tory MPs is thick enough to believe she's cut her own throat, if they don't support her rule unquestioningly.

They know she's a careerist; & her threat has zero credibility, as long as she remains an obvious careerist.

Ultimately, she just inherits the Bumblecunts mantle; if she's a net positive to the MPs re-election chances, they'll support her; otherwise she's fucked !

For the last number of weeks she's been pandering to bigots in the Tory membership; but now she has to negotiate with the MPs who didn't want her in the first place, & know she's a fucking liability, but she has to try & get them to push on with a program, that the MPs know will decide will either win, or lose them their seats in the next election, & if her program is what she promised to get elected, that certainly will lose them the election !

So she can do what she promised to get elected; & lose the GE, & destroy the Tories for a Generation.
Renege on all those promises & do what best for the Country, & piss off the ERG & lose the Leadership
..... something in between, that fucks the UK, & Tories

[Tichtheid]

The more Tory voters see of Liz Truss, the less they like her, polls show

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... polls-show


However, on polling for the next election.

Overall Labour lead by 4 points on 38% (-1 on a fortnight ago) while the Tories increased their vote share to 34% (+3) compared with mid-August.

With the worst prime minister in 50 years on the way out and a vacuous idiot on the way in, what does it say about Starmer and Labour that they don't have a 40+ point lead right now?

[tabascoboy]

Christ alive what a state we're in. Tweeter is Political Editor of the Sunday Times

[tabascoboy]

[_Os_]

However, on polling for the next election.

Overall Labour lead by 4 points on 38% (-1 on a fortnight ago) while the Tories increased their vote share to 34% (+3) compared with mid-August.

With the worst prime minister in 50 years on the way out and a vacuous idiot on the way in, what does it say about Starmer and Labour that they don't have a 40+ point lead right now?

At some point at least some responsibility and blame has to be apportioned to the voters, it can't all be only Labour's fault forever. Brown, Miliband, Corbyn, Starmer aren't all the same person with the same leadership team and policies, if only Labour is blamed then the reasons for Labour's failure over this time become contradictory.

[petej]

Christ alive what a state we're in. Tweeter is Political Editor of the Sunday Times

That is an awful cabinet.

However, on polling for the next election.

Overall Labour lead by 4 points on 38% (-1 on a fortnight ago) while the Tories increased their vote share to 34% (+3) compared with mid-August.

With the worst prime minister in 50 years on the way out and a vacuous idiot on the way in, what does it say about Starmer and Labour that they don't have a 40+ point lead right now?

At some point at least some responsibility and blame has to be apportioned to the voters, it can't all be only Labour's fault forever. Brown, Miliband, Corbyn, Starmer aren't all the same person with the same leadership team and policies, if only Labour is blamed then the reasons for Labour's failure over this time become contradictory.

Indeed. This government has an abusive relationship with the electorate and the worse the government is the harder it seems to be for the electorate to believe it can be better. The right wing press is there to convince the electorate it is them not government at fault.

[Tichtheid]

However, on polling for the next election.

Overall Labour lead by 4 points on 38% (-1 on a fortnight ago) while the Tories increased their vote share to 34% (+3) compared with mid-August.

With the worst prime minister in 50 years on the way out and a vacuous idiot on the way in, what does it say about Starmer and Labour that they don't have a 40+ point lead right now?

At some point at least some responsibility and blame has to be apportioned to the voters, it can't all be only Labour's fault forever. Brown, Miliband, Corbyn, Starmer aren't all the same person with the same leadership team and policies, if only Labour is blamed then the reasons for Labour's failure over this time become contradictory.

Oh I agree about the electorate, and I also recognise that Labour’s message is not really allowed to get through, but Starmer has to go on the offensive with the new PM and show there is a credible alternative to 12 years of austerity, corruption and self interest.

[I like neeps]

After her shambolic performance on Laura K's new programme I'm very excited for Truss' premiership. The whole one year of it!

[SaintK]

Christ alive what a state we're in. Tweeter is Political Editor of the Sunday Times

Fuck me that's an appalling cabinet.
Be afraid, be very, very afraid

[Insane_Homer]

Rich people benefiting more from her proposed tax cuts is 'fair' and nor will her plans lead to inflation since that's the BOEs problem.

At this rate, riots before xmas.

[I like neeps]

He has done a great job here showing Kuenssburg and the rest of the chattering class as nodding dogs.

As an aside, Kuenssburg is paid a fortune and has nothing to worry about. Which is what it is - being Dominic Cummings twitter admin is a demanding job. However, would be powerful if any of these shows had someone on 30k asking the questions rather 300k because it means something to them.

[dpedin]

Rich people benefiting more from her proposed tax cuts is 'fair' and nor will her plans lead to inflation since that's the BOEs problem.

At this rate, riots before xmas.

We're doomed!

[petej]

He has done a great job here showing Kuenssburg and the rest of the chattering class as nodding dogs.

As an aside, Kuenssburg is paid a fortune and has nothing to worry about. Which is what it is - being Dominic Cummings twitter admin is a demanding job. However, would be powerful if any of these shows had someone on 30k asking the questions rather 300k because it means something to them.

The political "journalist" and commentators are no better than football transfer journos. Football transfer gossip and political journalism is pretty similar. Kuenssburg should be paid at the level as the person who collates the BBC football transfer gossip.

It was noticeable during the pandemic that the standard of question when regional journalists were invited was much better and harder for Johnson than the soft shite from Peston and other nodding dogs.

[Paddington Bear]

He has done a great job here showing Kuenssburg and the rest of the chattering class as nodding dogs.

As an aside, Kuenssburg is paid a fortune and has nothing to worry about. Which is what it is - being Dominic Cummings twitter admin is a demanding job. However, would be powerful if any of these shows had someone on 30k asking the questions rather 300k because it means something to them.

The political "journalist" and commentators are no better than football transfer journos. Football transfer gossip and political journalism is pretty similar. Kuenssburg should be paid at the level as the person who collates the BBC football transfer gossip.

It was noticeable during the pandemic that the standard of question when regional journalists were invited was much better and harder for Johnson than the soft shite from Peston and other nodding dogs.

Yes, the main pundits are at their level talking about gossip and reshuffles. Anything policy related is beyond them

[sockwithaticket]

He has done a great job here showing Kuenssburg and the rest of the chattering class as nodding dogs.

As an aside, Kuenssburg is paid a fortune and has nothing to worry about. Which is what it is - being Dominic Cummings twitter admin is a demanding job. However, would be powerful if any of these shows had someone on 30k asking the questions rather 300k because it means something to them.

The political "journalist" and commentators are no better than football transfer journos. Football transfer gossip and political journalism is pretty similar. Kuenssburg should be paid at the level as the person who collates the BBC football transfer gossip.

It was noticeable during the pandemic that the standard of question when regional journalists were invited was much better and harder for Johnson than the soft shite from Peston and other nodding dogs.

Probably still more than she's worth...

[sockwithaticket]

Rich people benefiting more from her proposed tax cuts is 'fair' and nor will her plans lead to inflation since that's the BOEs problem.

At this rate, riots before xmas.

Honestly? I kind of hope so. Our collective lack of will to 'go French' and actually express our displeasure beyond tutting and making jokes about shit politicians is no small part of why we've arrived at this point.

The Tories are a pack of cunts and will behave as such. It is up to the people to reign them in and sometimes that means reminding politicians that they should be scared of us. They occupy their positions on our sufferance so long as they more or less uphold the social contract. They have manifestly failed to do that, in the process clearly demonstrating that they could not give less of a fuck about anyone who isn't a donor or chum.

[I like neeps]

Rich people benefiting more from her proposed tax cuts is 'fair' and nor will her plans lead to inflation since that's the BOEs problem.

At this rate, riots before xmas.

Honestly? I kind of hope so. Our collective lack of will to 'go French' and actually express our displeasure beyond tutting and making jokes about shit politicians is no small part of why we've arrived at this point.

The Tories are a pack of cunts and will behave as such. It is up to the people to reign them in and sometimes that means reminding politicians that they should be scared of us. They occupy their positions on our sufferance so long as they more or less uphold the social contract. They have manifestly failed to do that, in the process clearly demonstrating that they could not give less of a fuck about anyone who isn't a donor or chum.

Last time there were riots in this country Sir Keir decided on prison for everyone though. What's the judicial response in France? Most people probably think it isn't worth their time.

Not that the courts in this country function anymore so really the time is ripe.

[fishfoodie]

Rich people benefiting more from her proposed tax cuts is 'fair' and nor will her plans lead to inflation since that's the BOEs problem.

At this rate, riots before xmas.

Honestly? I kind of hope so. Our collective lack of will to 'go French' and actually express our displeasure beyond tutting and making jokes about shit politicians is no small part of why we've arrived at this point.

The Tories are a pack of cunts and will behave as such. It is up to the people to reign them in and sometimes that means reminding politicians that they should be scared of us. They occupy their positions on our sufferance so long as they more or less uphold the social contract. They have manifestly failed to do that, in the process clearly demonstrating that they could not give less of a fuck about anyone who isn't a donor or chum.

Last time there were riots in this country Sir Keir decided on prison for everyone though. What's the judicial response in France? Most people probably think it isn't worth their time.

Not that the courts in this country function anymore so really the time is ripe.

Àt least in prison the Tories would have to make sure they'd have adequate heat, & food, & health care, this winter.

[tabascoboy]

Honestly? I kind of hope so. Our collective lack of will to 'go French' and actually express our displeasure beyond tutting and making jokes about shit politicians is no small part of why we've arrived at this point.

The Tories are a pack of cunts and will behave as such. It is up to the people to reign them in and sometimes that means reminding politicians that they should be scared of us. They occupy their positions on our sufferance so long as they more or less uphold the social contract. They have manifestly failed to do that, in the process clearly demonstrating that they could not give less of a fuck about anyone who isn't a donor or chum.

Last time there were riots in this country Sir Keir decided on prison for everyone though. What's the judicial response in France? Most people probably think it isn't worth their time.

Not that the courts in this country function anymore so really the time is ripe.

Àt least in prison the Tories would have to make sure they'd have adequate heat, & food, & health care, this winter.

Change of regulations to make prisoners "suffer the consequences for crime" incoming in 3...2...1...

[Tichtheid]

Rich people benefiting more from her proposed tax cuts is 'fair' and nor will her plans lead to inflation since that's the BOEs problem.

At this rate, riots before xmas.

Honestly? I kind of hope so. Our collective lack of will to 'go French' and actually express our displeasure beyond tutting and making jokes about shit politicians is no small part of why we've arrived at this point.

The Tories are a pack of cunts and will behave as such. It is up to the people to reign them in and sometimes that means reminding politicians that they should be scared of us. They occupy their positions on our sufferance so long as they more or less uphold the social contract. They have manifestly failed to do that, in the process clearly demonstrating that they could not give less of a fuck about anyone who isn't a donor or chum.

Last time there were riots in this country Sir Keir decided on prison for everyone though. What's the judicial response in France? Most people probably think it isn't worth their time.

Not that the courts in this country function anymore so really the time is ripe.

When I was younger I'd go on marches and demos, they were generally peaceful, but the miners' strike was different.
I know a guy who threw a stone at a window of an empty mobile tea hut at a pit just outside Edinburgh. That footage was shown on the BBC six o'clock news. It was edited so that the stone appeared to hit a police officer at a pit in Yorkshire.
If he had that sort of arm on him he should have been in the Olympics.

Anyway, I've also been inadvertently caught in a demo when things went a wee bit ugly. I had my then 7 year old daughter with me (I wasn't on the march, I was just accidentally in the wrong place) and turned a corner to see EDL people smashing windows of cafes and shops. Mounted police were riding into the crowds and anarchists were throwing stones at the EDL and at the police.
I got my daughter out of there immediately.

No one wants full on riots, but recent government legislation is outlawing peaceful protest so that it will be dealt with in the same way riots are.

As far as I remember Starmer wanted to stop rioting, not to prevent protest. He spoke up against Johnson's idiotic and dangerous claims of rioting if his will on illegally proroguing parliament was opposed.
Starmer is not the villain here.

[C69]

Truss as PM ffs, let that sink in.

[fishfoodie]

Truss as PM ffs, let that sink in.

and the Bumblecunt waiting in the long grass, as a probable candidate for Leadership, when she inevitably fucks up !

It's like a significant number of the passengers voting to have the driver, who drove the bus over the cliff, but leapt to safety himself; drive the ambulance, with the survivors in the back, to the Hospital

You're just completely fucked !

[I like neeps]

Honestly? I kind of hope so. Our collective lack of will to 'go French' and actually express our displeasure beyond tutting and making jokes about shit politicians is no small part of why we've arrived at this point.

The Tories are a pack of cunts and will behave as such. It is up to the people to reign them in and sometimes that means reminding politicians that they should be scared of us. They occupy their positions on our sufferance so long as they more or less uphold the social contract. They have manifestly failed to do that, in the process clearly demonstrating that they could not give less of a fuck about anyone who isn't a donor or chum.

Last time there were riots in this country Sir Keir decided on prison for everyone though. What's the judicial response in France? Most people probably think it isn't worth their time.

Not that the courts in this country function anymore so really the time is ripe.

Àt least in prison the Tories would have to make sure they'd have adequate heat, & food, & health care, this winter.

I'm going to guess you aren't clued up on the state of UK prisons.

[I like neeps]

Honestly? I kind of hope so. Our collective lack of will to 'go French' and actually express our displeasure beyond tutting and making jokes about shit politicians is no small part of why we've arrived at this point.

The Tories are a pack of cunts and will behave as such. It is up to the people to reign them in and sometimes that means reminding politicians that they should be scared of us. They occupy their positions on our sufferance so long as they more or less uphold the social contract. They have manifestly failed to do that, in the process clearly demonstrating that they could not give less of a fuck about anyone who isn't a donor or chum.

Last time there were riots in this country Sir Keir decided on prison for everyone though. What's the judicial response in France? Most people probably think it isn't worth their time.

Not that the courts in this country function anymore so really the time is ripe.

When I was younger I'd go on marches and demos, they were generally peaceful, but the miners' strike was different.
I know a guy who threw a stone at a window of an empty mobile tea hut at a pit just outside Edinburgh. That footage was shown on the BBC six o'clock news. It was edited so that the stone appeared to hit a police officer at a pit in Yorkshire.
If he had that sort of arm on him he should have been in the Olympics.

Anyway, I've also been inadvertently caught in a demo when things went a wee bit ugly. I had my then 7 year old daughter with me (I wasn't on the march, I was just accidentally in the wrong place) and turned a corner to see EDL people smashing windows of cafes and shops. Mounted police were riding into the crowds and anarchists were throwing stones at the EDL and at the police.
I got my daughter out of there immediately.

No one wants full on riots, but recent government legislation is outlawing peaceful protest so that it will be dealt with in the same way riots are.

As far as I remember Starmer wanted to stop rioting, not to prevent protest. He spoke up against Johnson's idiotic and dangerous claims of rioting if his will on illegally proroguing parliament was opposed.
Starmer is not the villain here.

We weren't talking about protests though, we were talking about riots. And Starmer's response as Head of DPP was very harsh. I.e. a student with no priors getting the maximum sentence for nicking a bottle of water.

I imagine if you compare the French states reaction to rioting and the UKs you'd see why we don't do it so often.

[I like neeps]

Congratulations to Keir Starmer for winning the support of Nigel Farage. The type of guy the Labour movement needs onside.