The Official English Rugby Thread

[Ovals]

Still hoping it's not going to happen though deadline approaching fast
Must be so difficult for all the players and other employees.

Telegraph Sport understands that England wing Henry Arundell and World Cup hopeful Tom Pearson have both received at least four expressions of interest from various Premiership sides. Arundell, the explosive 20-year-old who made his first Test start against Ireland during the recent Six Nations, is believed to have provisional offers from France, with multiple Top 14 clubs in the running, as well as South Africa.
Pearson was voted as the Rugby Players’ Association young player of the year in recognition of his performances as Irish finished fifth in the Premiership. The all-action back-rower, and club captain Matt Rogerson, have been sounded out by Steve Borthwick and are in contention for England’s training camps this summer.
That pair could also benefit from the fact that Northampton Saints are in the market for a back-five forward after Lukhan Salakaia-Loto left for Australia last week. Harlequins and Bath are two other clubs said to be “respectfully keeping tabs on the situation” at Irish more generally.

https://12ft.io/proxy?ref=&q=https:// ... earson/

It's bloody awful - if the worst does happen the cream of the crop will no doubt pick up a decent gig, even if it's a major unplanned upheaval in their lives, but the club players and backroom are going to be left high and dry.

With Worcester, Wasps and Irish goingto the wall - that's nearly a 25% reduction in premiership players, coaches and other backroom staff - lots of them will have to find employment away from Rugby - tough times.

[Hal Jordan]

Harlequins and Bath are two other clubs said to be “respectfully keeping tabs on the situation” at Irish more generally.

The vultures are circling.

But with respect. No eating bits whilst Irish are still alive.

[Ovals]

Harlequins and Bath are two other clubs said to be “respectfully keeping tabs on the situation” at Irish more generally.

The vultures are circling.

But with respect. No eating bits whilst Irish are still alive.

Sounds like they are getting a one week's reprieve - which, I assume, would only be given if there were serious signs that a new onership deal was a realistic probability - which would be great news.

[Margin__Walker]

Harlequins and Bath are two other clubs said to be “respectfully keeping tabs on the situation” at Irish more generally.

The vultures are circling.

But with respect. No eating bits whilst Irish are still alive.

Sounds like they are getting a one week's reprieve - which, I assume, would only be given if there were serious signs that a new onership deal was a realistic probability - which would be great news.

This seems to be the situation. No extension actually granted yet. But one will be if:



Crossan paying wages is realistic. Documents actually being received today, is something I wouldn't bet my house on.

[JM2K6]

Fingers firmly crossed regardless.

[Paddington Bear]

Harlequins and Bath are two other clubs said to be “respectfully keeping tabs on the situation” at Irish more generally.

The vultures are circling.

But with respect. No eating bits whilst Irish are still alive.

My Great Aunt is on her last legs, dementia, care home etc. I went round to her house to sort some things yesterday, and left a note with the neighbour explaining the situation etc. He called me today to offer his sympathy, then began to tell me about how well he and her get on, how much he'd helped her out in old age, how it's his dream to move his daughter onto the same road as him and how my GA had always agreed it would be her dream as well. Feel like there's a lot of this 'respectfully keeping tabs on the situation' going round London at the moment.

[JM2K6]

Harlequins and Bath are two other clubs said to be “respectfully keeping tabs on the situation” at Irish more generally.

The vultures are circling.

But with respect. No eating bits whilst Irish are still alive.

My Great Aunt is on her last legs, dementia, care home etc. I went round to her house to sort some things yesterday, and left a note with the neighbour explaining the situation etc. He called me today to offer his sympathy, then began to tell me about how well he and her get on, how much he'd helped her out in old age, how it's his dream to move his daughter onto the same road as him and how my GA had always agreed it would be her dream as well. Feel like there's a lot of this 'respectfully keeping tabs on the situation' going round London at the moment.

Are you Nigel Wray??? Bloody hell, the cheek

[Punter15]

Still hoping it's not going to happen though deadline approaching fast
Must be so difficult for all the players and other employees.

https://12ft.io/proxy?ref=&q=https:// ... earson/

It's bloody awful - if the worst does happen the cream of the crop will no doubt pick up a decent gig, even if it's a major unplanned upheaval in their lives, but the club players and backroom are going to be left high and dry.

With Worcester, Wasps and Irish goingto the wall - that's nearly a 25% reduction in premiership players, coaches and other backroom staff - lots of them will have to find employment away from Rugby - tough times.

Three fewer games is about £1m in lost gate receipts. For clubs that mostly top out at £20m turnover that’s a hefty hit when they least need it.

[Margin__Walker]

Feels a bit like the end game today. If something substantive in the way of proof of funds/ownership details didn't emerge from the buyers yesterday (not seen anything to suggest it did) and we are trying to pay 50% of staff salaries, I can easily see the powers that be losing patience today.

[Rhubarb & Custard]

Three fewer games is about £1m in lost gate receipts. For clubs that mostly top out at £20m turnover that’s a hefty hit when they least need it.

Suddenly a virtue to Sale, Newcastle and Sarries drawing much smaller crowds, they'll lose nothing like that!

[Torquemada 1420]

Not looking like much hope left at Irish.
https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2023/ ... suspension

Being trying to understand their complicated structure and if anyone has an explanation.

The Wail reported

Over 250 players will now face the uncertainty of no employment next season

and my reaction was, "250. WTF?". No detail there either as to how that number could be correct.
I think factors in here might include
- Wild Geese. Supposedly amateurs but are they forced to sign Irish contracts so that, if necessary, they could be called up? So unpaid professionals? Whose status is under the same parent co as Irish but are actually Not Not Nots?
- Irish Exiles. Not sure where they fit into this but they were being partially funded by the IRFU. Given how strong the national team is and the regions, even if this were still receiving funding and somehow LIrish benefited in some way, I can't see what motivation there would be to continue to do so and not simply dump the money into Connacht.

[Margin__Walker]

Exiles are nothing to do with LI.

Wild geese won't be in those figures either.

Believe it comes from the RPA saying there are currently 170/80 (iirc) unemployed pro players in England following recent upheaval and adding all of the LI senior and senior academy squads to that number.

[sockwithaticket]

IIRC even before the Wasps and Worcester situation something like 100 players were being released from around the Prem without anywhere else lined up for one reason or another. I'd assume a lot of that number were academy products not making the grade.

[Margin__Walker]

IIRC even before the Wasps and Worcester situation something like 100 players were being released from around the Prem without anywhere else lined up for one reason or another. I'd assume a lot of that number were academy products not making the grade.

Yeah, agree. The number will be high, with plenty of players that wouldn't have made the grade and would have drifted away from the game or settled at a lower level anyway. Will also include some LI players that will walk into other clubs instantly.

Ultimately there will be a crunch with 13 squads going into 10 though and some players who would previously have comfortably sat on the edges of prem squads will find that the threshold has risen for that sort of role.

Plenty of upheaval for the RPA to manage though, fur sure. Some decent players will be struggling for squad slots.

[Kawazaki]

Surely it's more likely that players at Championship level will get elbowed out as the Championship clubs pick up Premiership quality players on the cheap?

[Torquemada 1420]

Surely it's more likely that players at Championship level will get elbowed out as the Championship clubs pick up Premiership quality players on the cheap?

Seems that way to me too. Lots of banging on about players going to France but the JIFF rules make that unlikely except for a limited few. We saw how tricky this is getting with Toulon chucking a load of espoirs out to try and balance their account in their last game (4 point min deduction for breach).

[Torquemada 1420]

I think we recognise that there are major problems with the Premiership
So it's taken you all week to come up with that crap!! You tedious, pompous knob

A week you say? You were counting (you can count?!)? And you think your monosyllabic posts merit my bothering to even look for, let alone attributing importance to hastily responding?

I imagine you in real life like that Tim character in Harry Enfield: nice chap but conversation becomes limited and rapidly descends into needing the nearest escape.

You okay torq? I'm not particularly engaged in this but you do seem to be misrepresenting poster's positions and the descent into personal abuse there is completely unnecessary. And woefully inaccurate. I've met saintk.

All good. Seems pretty bidirectional abuse.

[sockwithaticket]

Surely it's more likely that players at Championship level will get elbowed out as the Championship clubs pick up Premiership quality players on the cheap?

I reckon we'll see that over the next couple of seasons as spots open up, but the pro and semi-pro Champ sides will already have their squads under contract within their budgets. I'm not sure they've got an awful lot of standing capacity to absorb even Prem squad players.

[sockwithaticket]

Surely it's more likely that players at Championship level will get elbowed out as the Championship clubs pick up Premiership quality players on the cheap?

Seems that way to me too. Lots of banging on about players going to France but the JIFF rules make that unlikely except for a limited few. We saw how tricky this is getting with Toulon chucking a load of espoirs out to try and balance their account in their last game (4 point min deduction for breach).

Japan also has very strict regs now. Doesn't matter, though, the anglo-centric rugby press have their exodus narrative and are sticking with it.

[shaggy]

Surely it's more likely that players at Championship level will get elbowed out as the Championship clubs pick up Premiership quality players on the cheap?

Seems that way to me too. Lots of banging on about players going to France but the JIFF rules make that unlikely except for a limited few. We saw how tricky this is getting with Toulon chucking a load of espoirs out to try and balance their account in their last game (4 point min deduction for breach).

Japan also has very strict regs now. Doesn't matter, though, the anglo-centric rugby press have their exodus narrative and are sticking with it.

The more clicks they get the more rehashed stories will be published and the greater the level of poorly informed people there are.

[Torquemada 1420]

Surely it's more likely that players at Championship level will get elbowed out as the Championship clubs pick up Premiership quality players on the cheap?

Seems that way to me too. Lots of banging on about players going to France but the JIFF rules make that unlikely except for a limited few. We saw how tricky this is getting with Toulon chucking a load of espoirs out to try and balance their account in their last game (4 point min deduction for breach).

Japan also has very strict regs now. Doesn't matter, though, the anglo-centric rugby press have their exodus narrative and are sticking with it.

Confess I know nothing of Japan's regs.

[Torquemada 1420]

Seems that way to me too. Lots of banging on about players going to France but the JIFF rules make that unlikely except for a limited few. We saw how tricky this is getting with Toulon chucking a load of espoirs out to try and balance their account in their last game (4 point min deduction for breach).

Japan also has very strict regs now. Doesn't matter, though, the anglo-centric rugby press have their exodus narrative and are sticking with it.

The more clicks they get the more rehashed stories will be published and the greater the level of poorly informed people there are.

Welcome to Britain.

[shaggy]

Japan also has very strict regs now. Doesn't matter, though, the anglo-centric rugby press have their exodus narrative and are sticking with it.

The more clicks they get the more rehashed stories will be published and the greater the level of poorly informed people there are.

Welcome to Britain.

Take it somewhere else you tedious cunt.

[inactionman]

Japan also has very strict regs now. Doesn't matter, though, the anglo-centric rugby press have their exodus narrative and are sticking with it.

The more clicks they get the more rehashed stories will be published and the greater the level of poorly informed people there are.

Welcome to Britain.

Welcome to the World.

[Torquemada 1420]

The more clicks they get the more rehashed stories will be published and the greater the level of poorly informed people there are.

Welcome to Britain.

Take it somewhere else you tedious cunt.

As eloquent and erudite as ever.

[Torquemada 1420]

England U20s lose to Georgia 40-38.

[Lobby]

ASMO,

Can you move all of Torq's posts on this thread to their proper place

https://notplanetrugby.com/viewtopic.php?t=2511

Ta very much

[sockwithaticket]

Seems that way to me too. Lots of banging on about players going to France but the JIFF rules make that unlikely except for a limited few. We saw how tricky this is getting with Toulon chucking a load of espoirs out to try and balance their account in their last game (4 point min deduction for breach).

Japan also has very strict regs now. Doesn't matter, though, the anglo-centric rugby press have their exodus narrative and are sticking with it.

Confess I know nothing of Japan's regs.

According to an article I saw posted up on reddit the Top League's regs are now:
80% of a team's squad has to be Category A players
17 of the matchday 23 must be Category A players.

Category A = Japanese
Category B = Japan qualified
Category C = not Japan qualified.

[SaintK]

Irish hit with a winding up petition from HMRC
It’s all over bar a miracle

[Kawazaki]

Irish hit with a winding up petition from HMRC
It’s all over bar a miracle

Yep. That's a real kick in the bollocks.

[Margin__Walker]

Ultimately I think Crossan has hit more of a can't pay than wont pay wall. Guessing he's got liquidity issues or other extenuating personal circumstances that have reached a crisis point. It's easy to say he's worth so much etc and can afford it, but not if that wealth is tied up in Powerday and other assets. Finding £3m+ cash a year to cover LI losses is difficult.

Covid was badly timed for everyone, but I think it really hit us hard. We got relegated twice in a row operating on one of the smallest budgets in the league and I guess the thinking was that we just couldn't do that again and survive. He spent a lot of money on players and probably the upcoming move to Brentford in the summer after promotion in 2019. As it happens he needn't have spent as much as Sarries were doomed that year and then Covid hit swallowing CVC money and landing another £11m in DCSM debt and putting an end to relegation. Really was the perfect storm.

It's felt for a while like this iteration of the club is finished. For me it was the moment, we found out the buyers hadn't paid the March wages as originally reported. After that, they are just a faceless bunch who have never produced a thing of substance, and seem for all the world like they either haven't any money or are waiting until the business is more distressed to try and pick up what they are really after.

It's proper 1% territory, but the only straw worth clutching at the moment is Crossan paying the 50% this month. He's clearly desperate, but not sure he'd have done that if it was completely finished.

But realistically, it's finished

[shaggy]

Welcome to Britain.

Take it somewhere else you tedious cunt.

As eloquent and erudite as ever.

Get the fuck out you tedious cunt.

[westport]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/65797622

London Irish have been served a winding-up petition by HM Revenue & Customs over an unpaid tax bill.

[sockwithaticket]

Literally on the previous page, but we do appreciate the incursions to bring us bad news.

[Margin__Walker]

Ironically it doesn't really change a huge amount. The club's already set to hit a complete brick wall next week and in an alternate universe where the potential buyers were in any way serious, they would already have done their due diligence and know there was a pressing tax liability to factor in.

[fishfoodie]

Ironically it doesn't really change a huge amount. The club's already set to hit a complete brick wall next week and in an alternate universe where the potential buyers were in any way serious, they would already have done their due diligence and know there was a pressing tax liability to factor in.

Those pricks should have it made very, very clear to them, that if they don't complete this deal, they will forever be on the blacklist as they clearly aren't fit & proper persons.

[Torquemada 1420]

Japan also has very strict regs now. Doesn't matter, though, the anglo-centric rugby press have their exodus narrative and are sticking with it.

Confess I know nothing of Japan's regs.

According to an article I saw posted up on reddit the Top League's regs are now:
80% of a team's squad has to be Category A players
17 of the matchday 23 must be Category A players.

Category A = Japanese
Category B = Japan qualified
Category C = not Japan qualified.

Cheers

[Torquemada 1420]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/65797622

London Irish have been served a winding-up petition by HM Revenue & Customs over an unpaid tax bill.

Well that's that then.

[inactionman]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/65797622

London Irish have been served a winding-up petition by HM Revenue & Customs over an unpaid tax bill.

Well that's that then.

Ah Christ.

Sympathies to all the players, staff and fans - this is getting very painful.

[fishfoodie]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/65797622

London Irish have been served a winding-up petition by HM Revenue & Customs over an unpaid tax bill.

Well that's that then.

Ah Christ.

Sympathies to all the players, staff and fans - this is getting very painful.

Well as long as Bill Sweeney & all the club sugar daddies that are happy, that's all that counts.