Southport Incident

[Sandstorm]

There was feverish speculation about the murderer’s identity, during which the main rumour going round was that he was a muslim asylum seeker on MI6’s radar. The police have to be aware that more and more people are getting their news from social media, and are surely aware that these attacks spark said speculation and it matters to a large number of people. Both riots could have been mitigated by the police recognising we are in a different information age and acting faster.

But we are so far away from fact based responses nowadays. Complete fiction of all sorts get passed off as fact as a matter of course now. I don't know how we get back to a rational position now.

That's certainly true - people choose the facts they want.

It'd be nice if we called them out afterwards: False Facter or something equally catchy. Sadly Trump shows that you they'll just keep denying they said it, even when presented with the evidence in writing/video..

[Paddington Bear]

There was feverish speculation about the murderer’s identity, during which the main rumour going round was that he was a muslim asylum seeker on MI6’s radar. The police have to be aware that more and more people are getting their news from social media, and are surely aware that these attacks spark said speculation and it matters to a large number of people. Both riots could have been mitigated by the police recognising we are in a different information age and acting faster.

But we are so far away from fact based responses nowadays. Complete fiction of all sorts get passed off as fact as a matter of course now. I don't know how we get back to a rational position now.

This is true, and it’s why I say ‘mitigate’ rather than ‘eliminate’. In both situations I think far quicker releasing of key details turns the two riots from something the police struggled to contain into a small gathering of the usual morons they could break up without too much trouble.

The old rules have ceased to apply, people aren’t watching the 6 o’clock news and hearing ‘the suspect can’t be named for legal reasons’ and having no alternative. People want to know and unless they get something from an official source they are going to go to deliberately bad faith actors.

[Paddington Bear]

To be fair, when you said, "a total breakdown of trust between that community and the police; ", it not a stretch to think the community you meant was those living in the area.

Is the "community" you refer to the rioters? I've seen them here many times in Brighton, they come on their EDL marches, or under other banners, and are here for simple reasons, to fight and to vandalise


I haven't said anything about the attack - what is there to say? There are few things worse than innocent lives being shattered in this hideously violent way, the ones who survived will carry this with them for ever. I have three who when they were that age would have loved to have been dancing and making bracelets for and with their friends

‘ We’ve seen two riots in two weeks. Both by knuckle dragging droogs but for very different causes.

What unites the two is’

There was feverish speculation about the murderer’s identity, during which the main rumour going round was that he was a muslim asylum seeker on MI6’s radar. The police have to be aware that more and more people are getting their news from social media, and are surely aware that these attacks spark said speculation and it matters to a large number of people. Both riots could have been mitigated by the police recognising we are in a different information age and acting faster.

I'm still unsure who is in the "community" that you refer to as having "a total breakdown of trust" between themselves and the police

Feel this has been obvious throughout but the two communities I’m referring to are *sections* of the urban Muslim community and *sections* of the white working/lower middle class community, both of whom for different reasons have an exceptionally low opinion of the police

[Jockaline]

I was referring to the rioters not the people of Southport. That was completely blindingly obvious but you just wanted a chance to get a dig in

To be fair, when you said, "a total breakdown of trust between that community and the police; ", it not a stretch to think the community you meant was those living in the area.

Is the "community" you refer to the rioters? I've seen them here many times in Brighton, they come on their EDL marches, or under other banners, and are here for simple reasons, to fight and to vandalise


I haven't said anything about the attack - what is there to say? There are few things worse than innocent lives being shattered in this hideously violent way, the ones who survived will carry this with them for ever. I have three who when they were that age would have loved to have been dancing and making bracelets for and with their friends

‘ We’ve seen two riots in two weeks. Both by knuckle dragging droogs but for very different causes.

What unites the two is’

There was feverish speculation about the murderer’s identity, during which the main rumour going round was that he was a muslim asylum seeker on MI6’s radar. The police have to be aware that more and more people are getting their news from social media, and are surely aware that these attacks spark said speculation and it matters to a large number of people. Both riots could have been mitigated by the police recognising we are in a different information age and acting faster.

Doesn't matter what the police say, we have a sitting (in the loosest term of the word) MP implying that they are liars.

[inactionman]

These cunts should be nowhere near the military, it's not the military problem to solve. Poor recruitment isn't just down to capita, retention is probably a bigger issue. I'd not want some cunt that is a conscript in combat with me, fuck that!! There's also not enough NCOs to train them and not enough training estates either. It's a non starter that would erode our forces.

Fair enough.

Would you wonder whether their actions are to do with frustration, senses of powerlessness and a huge helping of ignorance, and that exposing them to something like national service might be of some use? We're not talking of putting them on front lines, we're not Russia.

Or bang them up, ostracise them, make them unemployable and then cross fingers that they stop being arseholes?

Did nobody who's previously done national service commit crime?

When the next conflict rolls around and units are doing back to back tours how long will it be until these men and women are augmenting regular units? Where are they being based? What are they being paid? What roles are they fulfilling? Why is it the military's role to sort out society's problem? What happens when they go AWOL?

I'm a bit concerned you're saying these are all - to a man - inherently and irredeemably bad people. I think they're mainly people who have been fed bullshit their entire lives and don't have the wherewithal to see through it. I'm sure there are a fair few psychopaths, and far too many dogwhistlers who exploit these people's misconceptions and prejudice. Removing some of these influenced people from an environment where all they hear are dogwhistles would seem a good step.

I'd also prefer that national service - if we had it - was built more on the Isreali model. It's not necessarily a direct military thing, you could go into a whole range of disciplines (there is also something called Sherut Leumi where people can go to work at schools, hospitals etc but that is meant more for objectors to military service). I agree you'd not want a modern army (well, any army, but especially a small, professional army) built upon and around reluctant people who are only there as it was forced on them - the miltiary gets proposed a lot in these conversations for obvious reasons but it's not the only option. Have them landscaping public parks for all I really care, but at least something that is contributing.

Anyway all a digression - we need to do something about these people, and I can't see ostracising them socially doing much more then entrenching their idiocy.

[Jockaline]

‘ We’ve seen two riots in two weeks. Both by knuckle dragging droogs but for very different causes.

What unites the two is’

There was feverish speculation about the murderer’s identity, during which the main rumour going round was that he was a muslim asylum seeker on MI6’s radar. The police have to be aware that more and more people are getting their news from social media, and are surely aware that these attacks spark said speculation and it matters to a large number of people. Both riots could have been mitigated by the police recognising we are in a different information age and acting faster.

I'm still unsure who is in the "community" that you refer to as having "a total breakdown of trust" between themselves and the police

Feel this has been obvious throughout but the two communities I’m referring to are *sections* of the urban Muslim community and *sections* of the white working/lower middle class community, both of whom for different reasons have an exceptionally low opinion of the police

I wouldn't be so sure the white far right/doleites don't have some respect for the police, some of the are in it. They just useful combatants for a jolly day out fighting and rioting. They always turn up and are goaded into a response, they probable hate it when they don't get one. They also know they won't fight them back too hard like other countries, or punish them in any meaningful way.

Was it the Muslim community that rioted in Leeds, or just anyone looking for trouble it's far from clear to me.

[tabascoboy]

And now we have Twatter awash with outraged comments about the disorder in Southend and "masked Africans" when the greater likelihood is that those involved were from East London street gangs organising through Social Media, This isn't even a new thing when it's been going on there and Brighton for decades, even if last night's was significantly more dangerous with machetes wielded openly.

Not saying that it isn't a worrying thing that needs suitable action taken against those involved of course, whatever their background is.

The local MP Bayo Alaba said there was "a pattern" of people posting on social media about planned meet-ups on the beach, which needed to be "looked at differently".

[Margin__Walker]

I was referring to the rioters not the people of Southport. That was completely blindingly obvious but you just wanted a chance to get a dig in

To be fair, when you said, "a total breakdown of trust between that community and the police; ", it not a stretch to think the community you meant was those living in the area.

Is the "community" you refer to the rioters? I've seen them here many times in Brighton, they come on their EDL marches, or under other banners, and are here for simple reasons, to fight and to vandalise


I haven't said anything about the attack - what is there to say? There are few things worse than innocent lives being shattered in this hideously violent way, the ones who survived will carry this with them for ever. I have three who when they were that age would have loved to have been dancing and making bracelets for and with their friends

‘ We’ve seen two riots in two weeks. Both by knuckle dragging droogs but for very different causes.

What unites the two is’

There was feverish speculation about the murderer’s identity, during which the main rumour going round was that he was a muslim asylum seeker on MI6’s radar. The police have to be aware that more and more people are getting their news from social media, and are surely aware that these attacks spark said speculation and it matters to a large number of people. Both riots could have been mitigated by the police recognising we are in a different information age and acting faster.

Sorry, but I'm not sure what the police can do.

They arrest a 17 year old that I'm fairly sure they are legally unable to name.

Malicious rumours get spread online saying he's called Ali something-or-other, fresh off the boat in an asylum seeker house on an MI6 watchlist. Idiots take this at face value so the authorities confirm he's UK born to Rwandan parents. They acted, but it doesn't matter. The people doing this are mostly blow ins only interested in their own agenda.

[C69]

To be fair, when you said, "a total breakdown of trust between that community and the police; ", it not a stretch to think the community you meant was those living in the area.

Is the "community" you refer to the rioters? I've seen them here many times in Brighton, they come on their EDL marches, or under other banners, and are here for simple reasons, to fight and to vandalise


I haven't said anything about the attack - what is there to say? There are few things worse than innocent lives being shattered in this hideously violent way, the ones who survived will carry this with them for ever. I have three who when they were that age would have loved to have been dancing and making bracelets for and with their friends

‘ We’ve seen two riots in two weeks. Both by knuckle dragging droogs but for very different causes.

What unites the two is’

There was feverish speculation about the murderer’s identity, during which the main rumour going round was that he was a muslim asylum seeker on MI6’s radar. The police have to be aware that more and more people are getting their news from social media, and are surely aware that these attacks spark said speculation and it matters to a large number of people. Both riots could have been mitigated by the police recognising we are in a different information age and acting faster.

Sorry, but I'm not sure what the police can do.

They arrest a 17 year old that I'm fairly sure they are legally unable to name.

Malicious rumours get spread online saying he's called Ali something-or-other, fresh off the boat in an asylum seeker house on an MI6 watchlist. Idiots take this at face value so the authorities confirm he's UK born to Rwandan parents. They acted, but it doesn't matter. The people doing this are only interested in their own agenda.

This is absolutely nothing to do with a breakdown in trust in the local community. The community are on the side of the police. Any suggestion otherwise is mistaken.

This reiterates my post earlier. Both myself and MW live in the area. The support for the police is unwavering.
The Community is fully behind the police and to see outside actors from the right whipping up racial tension and riots is disgusting.
To suggest otherwise is crass.

[Sandstorm]

I could watch this all day.

[Paddington Bear]

‘ We’ve seen two riots in two weeks. Both by knuckle dragging droogs but for very different causes.

What unites the two is’

There was feverish speculation about the murderer’s identity, during which the main rumour going round was that he was a muslim asylum seeker on MI6’s radar. The police have to be aware that more and more people are getting their news from social media, and are surely aware that these attacks spark said speculation and it matters to a large number of people. Both riots could have been mitigated by the police recognising we are in a different information age and acting faster.

Sorry, but I'm not sure what the police can do.

They arrest a 17 year old that I'm fairly sure they are legally unable to name.

Malicious rumours get spread online saying he's called Ali something-or-other, fresh off the boat in an asylum seeker house on an MI6 watchlist. Idiots take this at face value so the authorities confirm he's UK born to Rwandan parents. They acted, but it doesn't matter. The people doing this are only interested in their own agenda.

This is absolutely nothing to do with a breakdown in trust in the local community. The community are on the side of the police. Any suggestion otherwise is mistaken.

This reiterates my post earlier. Both myself and MW live in the area. The support for the police is unwavering.
The Community is fully behind the police and to see outside actors from the right whipping up racial tension and riots is disgusting.
To suggest otherwise is crass.

Which would be an excellent point if anyone *had* suggested otherwise

[Paddington Bear]

To be fair, when you said, "a total breakdown of trust between that community and the police; ", it not a stretch to think the community you meant was those living in the area.

Is the "community" you refer to the rioters? I've seen them here many times in Brighton, they come on their EDL marches, or under other banners, and are here for simple reasons, to fight and to vandalise


I haven't said anything about the attack - what is there to say? There are few things worse than innocent lives being shattered in this hideously violent way, the ones who survived will carry this with them for ever. I have three who when they were that age would have loved to have been dancing and making bracelets for and with their friends

‘ We’ve seen two riots in two weeks. Both by knuckle dragging droogs but for very different causes.

What unites the two is’

There was feverish speculation about the murderer’s identity, during which the main rumour going round was that he was a muslim asylum seeker on MI6’s radar. The police have to be aware that more and more people are getting their news from social media, and are surely aware that these attacks spark said speculation and it matters to a large number of people. Both riots could have been mitigated by the police recognising we are in a different information age and acting faster.

Sorry, but I'm not sure what the police can do.

They arrest a 17 year old that I'm fairly sure they are legally unable to name.

Malicious rumours get spread online saying he's called Ali something-or-other, fresh off the boat in an asylum seeker house on an MI6 watchlist. Idiots take this at face value so the authorities confirm he's UK born to Rwandan parents. They acted, but it doesn't matter. The people doing this are mostly blow ins only interested in their own agenda.

They need to change procedures to reflect how fast disinformation travels. As we’ve seen recently, you don’t need to be an idiot, a fascist or a communist to believe something you’ve seen online that later turns out to be untrue. By the time they realised this would cause an issue they acted as you said. They are going to need to be more proactive in future. You can’t stop everyone but they would have been dealing with a smaller incident

[Paddington Bear]

I'm still unsure who is in the "community" that you refer to as having "a total breakdown of trust" between themselves and the police

Feel this has been obvious throughout but the two communities I’m referring to are *sections* of the urban Muslim community and *sections* of the white working/lower middle class community, both of whom for different reasons have an exceptionally low opinion of the police

I wouldn't be so sure the white far right/doleites don't have some respect for the police, some of the are in it. They just useful combatants for a jolly day out fighting and rioting. They always turn up and are goaded into a response, they probable hate it when they don't get one. They also know they won't fight them back too hard like other countries, or punish them in any meaningful way.

Was it the Muslim community that rioted in Leeds, or just anyone looking for trouble it's far from clear to me.

They have respect for police when they’re kicking Muslims in the head, and I’d imagine have a residual respect for thin blue line stuff. As anyone online yesterday could see, they have a pretty strong belief that the police prioritise the rights of migrants over them, see them chanting ‘you’re not English anymore’ at the Cenotaph late last year.

[Margin__Walker]

‘ We’ve seen two riots in two weeks. Both by knuckle dragging droogs but for very different causes.

What unites the two is’

There was feverish speculation about the murderer’s identity, during which the main rumour going round was that he was a muslim asylum seeker on MI6’s radar. The police have to be aware that more and more people are getting their news from social media, and are surely aware that these attacks spark said speculation and it matters to a large number of people. Both riots could have been mitigated by the police recognising we are in a different information age and acting faster.

Sorry, but I'm not sure what the police can do.

They arrest a 17 year old that I'm fairly sure they are legally unable to name.

Malicious rumours get spread online saying he's called Ali something-or-other, fresh off the boat in an asylum seeker house on an MI6 watchlist. Idiots take this at face value so the authorities confirm he's UK born to Rwandan parents. They acted, but it doesn't matter. The people doing this are mostly blow ins only interested in their own agenda.

They need to change procedures to reflect how fast disinformation travels. As we’ve seen recently, you don’t need to be an idiot, a fascist or a communist to believe something you’ve seen online that later turns out to be untrue. By the time they realised this would cause an issue they acted as you said. They are going to need to be more proactive in future. You can’t stop everyone but they would have been dealing with a smaller incident

Change procedures to do what? Short of being able to name him, what should they do?

These pricks aren't bothered. It's all an excuse for their bullshit

[epwc]

I could watch this all day.

Worthy of an award

[Sandstorm]

I could watch this all day.

Worthy of an award

Silly arse should have stayed on his decorating job instead of going out to be a cnut.

[Paddington Bear]

Sorry, but I'm not sure what the police can do.

They arrest a 17 year old that I'm fairly sure they are legally unable to name.

Malicious rumours get spread online saying he's called Ali something-or-other, fresh off the boat in an asylum seeker house on an MI6 watchlist. Idiots take this at face value so the authorities confirm he's UK born to Rwandan parents. They acted, but it doesn't matter. The people doing this are mostly blow ins only interested in their own agenda.

They need to change procedures to reflect how fast disinformation travels. As we’ve seen recently, you don’t need to be an idiot, a fascist or a communist to believe something you’ve seen online that later turns out to be untrue. By the time they realised this would cause an issue they acted as you said. They are going to need to be more proactive in future. You can’t stop everyone but they would have been dealing with a smaller incident

Change procedures to do what? Short of being able to name him, what should they do?

These pricks aren't bothered. It's all an excuse for their bullshit

We have evidence from the GMP incident that issuing clarifying evidence calms situations straight away. They could have said ‘17 year old of [x] heritage’ as soon as they arrested him. Some of these guys would have stirred up trouble anyway, but what happened was an absolute frenzy of speculation. Current procedures can’t cope with social media being a large section of the public’s main (only) source of news

[Margin__Walker]

Nah, that's a cop out. Everyone there chucking bricks would have known he was Rwandan. That had been released well in advance of the riot.

This is scum on a day out wrecking a neighborhood and assaulting the police. Not citizens with understandable concerns. If pricks want to riot, they can do it in Westminster, not a grieving community

[Calculon]

Sorry, but I'm not sure what the police can do.

They arrest a 17 year old that I'm fairly sure they are legally unable to name.

Malicious rumours get spread online saying he's called Ali something-or-other, fresh off the boat in an asylum seeker house on an MI6 watchlist. Idiots take this at face value so the authorities confirm he's UK born to Rwandan parents. They acted, but it doesn't matter. The people doing this are mostly blow ins only interested in their own agenda.

They need to change procedures to reflect how fast disinformation travels. As we’ve seen recently, you don’t need to be an idiot, a fascist or a communist to believe something you’ve seen online that later turns out to be untrue. By the time they realised this would cause an issue they acted as you said. They are going to need to be more proactive in future. You can’t stop everyone but they would have been dealing with a smaller incident

Change procedures to do what? Short of being able to name him, what should they do?

These pricks aren't bothered. It's all an excuse for their bullshit

I don't know the exact timeline regarding the reporting of this incident but I'm also sceptical the police could have done any better. By the time I heard of this it was already widely reported this was a black British guy with parents from Rwanda, an overwhelmingly Christian county, and not thought to be terror related.

I didn't realize some people were blaming Muslims until some time afterwards when DAC came on here saying you can't trust the MSM and blaming Islam. Just seem that people like this are not going to change their beliefs and actions if the info was released a bit earlier

[_Os_]

Doesn't matter what the police say, we have a sitting (in the loosest term of the word) MP implying that they are liars.

There's also the media outlets taking an EDL type line.

That somehow the killer is a Muslim and therefore this horrific crime is the fault of Islam (unknown, given his parents are from Rwanda he's more likely to be Christian), that somehow this crime means "we have a problem with Islamism" and "no one will ever tell us the truth". Starmer not correct to say rioters attacking a Mosque should be punished, instead people are "right to be angry" and the police are to blame for not releasing information (which they in fact did release). That multiculturalism doesn't work and immigration is the problem (the bar seems to be evil people who aren't white shouldn't exist), given the killer's background it seems unlikely he lived his life only around Rwandans (not many in the UK) and he isn't an immigrant, the guy given a platform to say this is unlike the killer actually is an immigrant from Pakistan.

All these takes from this Murdoch outlet are days after many details are known and the day after the riot. They know what they're doing and who they're appealing to.

[epwc]

Nah, that's a cop out. Everyone there chucking bricks would have known he was Rwandan. That had been released well in advance of the riot.

This is scum on a day out wrecking a neighborhood and assaulting the police. Not citizens with understandable concerns. If pricks want to riot, they can do it in Westminster, not a grieving community

I think I agree with all of that. And even if they believed the boy to be Muslim how did that display of mindless violence help this grieving and I'd imagine shattered community?

Just random thugs looking for trouble, especially if its got a Muslamic tinge

[Jock42]

Fair enough.

Would you wonder whether their actions are to do with frustration, senses of powerlessness and a huge helping of ignorance, and that exposing them to something like national service might be of some use? We're not talking of putting them on front lines, we're not Russia.

Or bang them up, ostracise them, make them unemployable and then cross fingers that they stop being arseholes?

Did nobody who's previously done national service commit crime?

When the next conflict rolls around and units are doing back to back tours how long will it be until these men and women are augmenting regular units? Where are they being based? What are they being paid? What roles are they fulfilling? Why is it the military's role to sort out society's problem? What happens when they go AWOL?

I'm a bit concerned you're saying these are all - to a man - inherently and irredeemably bad people.

You can be as concerned as you want about things I've not said.

[Sandstorm]

Doesn't matter what the police say, we have a sitting (in the loosest term of the word) MP implying that they are liars.

There's also the media outlets taking an EDL type line.

Why are you posting that utter gutter-garbage here?

[Jockaline]

Doesn't matter what the police say, we have a sitting (in the loosest term of the word) MP implying that they are liars.

There's also the media outlets taking an EDL type line.

Why are you posting that utter gutter-garbage here?

To show how big a problem we have in the UK now? Their publicists/cheerleaders have woven themselves into our society, including media and parliament, and some folk are falling for their narrative hook line and sinker. Ignoring the threat won't make it go away.

[Sandstorm]

To show how big a problem we have in the UK now? Their publicists/cheerleaders have woven themselves into our society, including media and parliament, and some folk are falling for their narrative hook line and sinker. Ignoring the threat won't make it go away.

Fox News has a 10000 times bigger audience than Talk TV does and they've been doing it since the 1990s. It's a massive problem everywhere. And stupid people have been believing bullshit since the first time someone stood preaching on a mount in a desert....

[_Os_]

There's also the media outlets taking an EDL type line.

Why are you posting that utter gutter-garbage here?

To show how big a problem we have in the UK now? Their publicists/cheerleaders have woven themselves into our society, including media and parliament, and some folk are falling for their narrative hook line and sinker. Ignoring the threat won't make it go away.

Exactly. The police aren't to blame for that.

There may be some worthwhile stuff worth investigating around this killer and integration etc (no clue, seems unlikely given there's completely unintegrated people who don't commit horrific crimes like this, but maybe there's something in it). A lot of the UK media isn't capable of ever getting to whatever truth there may be in that, they're interested in using crimes to radicalise people. If they have to get sneaky and use words like "immigrant" to describe people who aren't in fact immigrants, then they're going to do that. If they have to call someone a Muslim when it isn't known if they are, then they're going to do that.

[Uncle fester]

I've just spoken to someone who lives in the area where the violence broke out last night. He wants to stay anonymous.

"I’d driven to see my mum and drove my car through a mob of angry people," he says.

"They weren't from Southport, you could tell from their accents. A lot of the people who were there were there to cause trouble. They were wearing masks. It was a free for all.

"The robbed a shop down the road. They knocked my wall down to get the bricks to use as missiles.

"They stood on cars. They were taking for sale signs from people's gardens and using them as missiles.

"I wasn't going to let them attack my house, that’s why I was stood on the drive. I feel sorry for the emergency services because they were in the thick of it."

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/c3gr5ljyz41t

Carbon copy of what is happening in Ireland. Refugee centre in small village but the place gets flooded with far right types pretending to be concerned locals. Hilariously one of the "locals" they were able to put in front of the cameras was an English immigrant.

[geordie_6]

Think of the four arrested so far (as of earlier today) only one was a Southport resident. One was staying in a nearby Probation Hostel (hopefully that'll be getting addressed in short order) and the other two were out of area knobheads.

[Uncle fester]

I tend to agree with Slick.

We’ve seen two riots in two weeks. Both by knuckle dragging droogs but for very different causes.

What unites the two is:
1) a total breakdown of trust between that community and the police; and
2) the absence of information from the police that would have likely mitigated the situation allowed fake narratives to spread that inflamed tensions.

Basically, in the age we live, the police have to work faster. Probably everyone at GMP knew quickly that the incident had started with haymakers to the back of a policeman’s head. They had to get that footage out there far quicker than they did. The police knew the murderer was not a Muslim, and had to issue information confirming his background then telling everyone to let justice take its course basically straight away.

As a country we have to do better than this. Multiple children stabbed in cold blood has to lead to more than thoughts and prayers.

The police released the information early that the killer is British and his parents are from Rwanda, they also immediately said that it wasn't a terror incident. I'm not sure how much quicker the police could've been without risking the release of info which turns out to be false, which would've damaged police credibility.

In Southport a group of highly motivated actors immediately started lying to gain political capital from a horrific crime. A lot of them have huge media platforms, or are actual media platforms (imagine being an editor and immediately deciding to run with "multi culturalism has failed" type lines). Unlike Manchester this crime is quite uncomfortable to talk about at all because of its horrific nature, unimaginable to try and gain from it somehow. But that's what the likes of Frog Face have decided to do, he's an elected MP but refused to go to Parliament and ask questions he deems important when this crime was discussed, instead he's on social media claiming "I just wonder if the truth is being withheld from us" (by us he presumably means elected MPs who refuse to turn up and ask questions?).

The agenda of Frog Face and friends is becoming more mask off by the day. They also blamed the Harehills riot in Leeds on Muslims and immigrants. I went on the census map to see what the demographics of that area were, it's less than 20% white and less than 10% white British, but (from memory) it was 70% British nationals with a small majority of the area UK born. Before the stuff about the spark being child services and the Roma, it was very obvious during that incident that "immigrant" was being used by people who really meant "not white". Frog Face has done this before, he said most people in London weren't British when a majority of people in London were born in the UK, he conflated not being white with being an immigrant and ignored all criticism pointing that out. To my knowledge he never corrects any of these conflations between immigrants and people who aren't white.

Once police said this killer was black British, not many of those rioting would've given a shit. To them that is a "immigrant", a convient word they use to hide their real views.

That's very true. You see it with elements of the British expat community in Spain complaining about immigration there without the sense of irony to understand that they are also immigrants.

[C69]

Hmm if it transpires that this 17 year old is from a Church going Christian family then are the Churches going to be burnt down?

[Margin__Walker]

Hmm if it transpires that this 17 year old is from a Church going Christian family then are the Churches going to be burnt down?

Who knows what he purports to believe in now. Perhaps he was raised Muslim or is a convert, but his potential (very plausible) identity, complete with primary school photo did the rounds on a WhatsApp group I'm in yesterday.

That primary school was a faith school, and it wasn't a Muslim one.

[epwc]

Just got back from chiropractor, the woman in before me was telling the chiropractor about Southend. She said she was there and saw it all with her own eyes, 4 or 5 fellas had machetes, apparently Asian looking, probably Albanian.

No room in the prisons so they should just shoot them, yep should have called the swat team and just shot em dead.

[sefton]

Hmm if it transpires that this 17 year old is from a Church going Christian family then are the Churches going to be burnt down?

Who knows what he purports to believe in now. Perhaps he was raised Muslim or is a convert, but his potential (very plausible) identity, complete with primary school photo did the rounds on a WhatsApp group I'm in yesterday.

That primary school was a faith school, and it wasn't a Muslim one.

He’s not a Muslim.

[Slick]

Just had a dip into Twitter… it really does need to be banned, absolute madness

[tabascoboy]

The meatheads have descended on Downing Street tonight and it's kicking off again, I'm sure that the occasional Nazi salute is purely ironic

[C69]

All quiet tonight.
There were report of planned riots etc


Great to see the locals helping shop owners and residents with windows brocken given free repairs


Anecdotally people seen to have caused this may have been told to go else where.

[_Os_]

By the looks of what's on Twitter quite a lot of violence in Hartlepool last night (a 96% white town). Police dogs set on "protestors", a random brown man walking past assaulted (punched in the head) by the cheering "protestors", a residential house attacked by "protestors" as they chant "Tommy Robinson" presumably a brown/black person dared to live there.

In Aldershot a peaceful protest at a migrant hotel.

... None of these people give a shit that the killer wasn't an immigrant. When they use the word "immigrant" they mean people who are not white be they British or not.

[Sandstorm]

By the looks of what's on Twitter quite a lot of violence in Hartlepool last night (a 96% white town). Police dogs set on "protestors", a random brown man walking past assaulted (punched in the head) by the cheering "protestors", a residential house attacked by "protestors" as they chant "Tommy Robinson" presumably a brown/black person dared to live there.

In Aldershot a peaceful protest at a migrant hotel.

... None of these people give a shit that the killer wasn't an immigrant. When they use the word "immigrant" they mean people who are not white be they British or not.

Sunny days bring out the racists & the nutters. Need more rain.

[robmatic]

... None of these people give a shit that the killer wasn't an immigrant. When they use the word "immigrant" they mean people who are not white be they British or not.

A bit like when they talk about Muslims outbreeding the native population. Because Islam is genetic, apparently.

[C69]

... None of these people give a shit that the killer wasn't an immigrant. When they use the word "immigrant" they mean people who are not white be they British or not.

A bit like when they talk about Muslims outbreeding the native population. Because Islam is genetic, apparently.

So the maniac was born in Wales and was a Christian.

Hmmmm not an immigrant and not a Muslim.

I just wonder if he was white, would a Mosque have been targeted.

That said the maniac will not see freedom again and will be a target whether in a secure hospital or prison.