NPR

remarkable stuff

I like neeps wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 7:26 pm Kwasi Kwarteng, Boris Johnson, Priti Patel, Nadine Dorries, Theresa May all voted against the motion. Would be funny if Truss suspends them all to be fair. Like when Johnson sacked Gove as a last hurrah.

No they didn’t. They didn’t vote at all, which is not quite the same thing, although the whips had previously threatened to throw out anyone who abstained, as well as those actively voting against the Govt. Incidentally, Truss didn’t vote either, so perhaps she’ll kick herself out of the party.

Comments suggesting he has passed photos to the Dept Speaker.

JRM & Coffey should be suspended immediately

Biffer wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 7:00 pm

salanya wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 6:47 pm Tory backbencher (Charles Walker) calling the right-wingers out live on BBC now. He's absolutely livid, and calling out 'talentless' people.

And I forgot to get popcorn :(

Wow

For a speech about his colleagues putting their career above national interest he does mention the interest he has in his friends keeping their jobs quite a lot doesn't he.

Lobby wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 7:32 pm

I like neeps wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 7:26 pm Kwasi Kwarteng, Boris Johnson, Priti Patel, Nadine Dorries, Theresa May all voted against the motion. Would be funny if Truss suspends them all to be fair. Like when Johnson sacked Gove as a last hurrah.

No they didn’t. They didn’t vote at all, which is not quite the same thing, although the whips had previously threatened to throw out anyone who abstained, as well as those actively voting against the Govt. Incidentally, Truss didn’t vote either, so perhaps she’ll kick herself out of the party.

Oh that's shame. Truss resigning and kicking herself out of the party is the smart choice for her.

I like neeps wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 7:36 pm

Lobby wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 7:32 pm

I like neeps wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 7:26 pm Kwasi Kwarteng, Boris Johnson, Priti Patel, Nadine Dorries, Theresa May all voted against the motion. Would be funny if Truss suspends them all to be fair. Like when Johnson sacked Gove as a last hurrah.

No they didn’t. They didn’t vote at all, which is not quite the same thing, although the whips had previously threatened to throw out anyone who abstained, as well as those actively voting against the Govt. Incidentally, Truss didn’t vote either, so perhaps she’ll kick herself out of the party.

Oh that's shame. Truss resigning and kicking herself out of the party is the smart choice for her.

Apparently Truss missed the vote because she was dealing with the resignations of the Chief Whip and Deputy Chief Whip.

Settled in for the night - gin bought and popcorn in a bowl - watching Man Utd v Tottenham as a warm up - roll on the news!

Edit: Just caught Krishnan from C4 calling Steve Baker a Cnut on twitter - brilliant. Tonights news coverage is surely worth a BAFTA?

Was the word; Cunt, Krishnan ?

If so, it was certainly not, in any way, out of line, just understandable in the presence of such an odious, lying ball of intolerance & vileness.

dpedin wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 7:46 pm Settled in for the night - gin bought and popcorn in a bowl - watching Man Utd v Tottenham as a warm up - roll on the news!

I think the guy doing the newsflash ticker on Sky, has gone home sick with carpal tunnel after the day so far...

Lobby wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 7:42 pm

I like neeps wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 7:36 pm

Lobby wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 7:32 pm

No they didn’t. They didn’t vote at all, which is not quite the same thing, although the whips had previously threatened to throw out anyone who abstained, as well as those actively voting against the Govt. Incidentally, Truss didn’t vote either, so perhaps she’ll kick herself out of the party.

Oh that's shame. Truss resigning and kicking herself out of the party is the smart choice for her.

Apparently Truss missed the vote because she was dealing with the resignations of the Chief Whip and Deputy Chief Whip.

The Whips didn't vote either. Utterly clueless leadership - why create such a mess over a vote they were hardly likely to lose anyway - even with all those not voting they had a 96 majority.

Ovals wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 7:51 pm

Lobby wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 7:42 pm

I like neeps wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 7:36 pm

Oh that's shame. Truss resigning and kicking herself out of the party is the smart choice for her.

Apparently Truss missed the vote because she was dealing with the resignations of the Chief Whip and Deputy Chief Whip.

The Whips didn't vote either. Utterly clueless leadership - why create such a mess over a vote they were hardly likely to lose anyway - even with all those not voting they had a 96 majority.

I guess because Truss made such a song and dance about fracking it's at least something to point to as an achievement.

It's getting quite hard to see how the next PM isn't Johnson. The rabidly Tory outriders such as Guido and Haywood are saying. Won't be long before Choppers gets in on the action too.

Poster of this tweet has no special inside info I'm sure but would be kinda funny if true

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 7:34 pm Comments suggesting he has passed photos to the Dept Speaker.

JRM & Coffey should be suspended immediately

Looks like he has.

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 8:03 pm

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 7:34 pm Comments suggesting he has passed photos to the Dept Speaker.

JRM & Coffey should be suspended immediately

Looks like he has.

Very hard to see any actual evidence of anything here. Also he'll get in trouble for posting pictures in the lobby you'd think.

I like neeps wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 8:05 pm

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 8:03 pm

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 7:34 pm Comments suggesting he has passed photos to the Dept Speaker.

JRM & Coffey should be suspended immediately

Looks like he has.

Very hard to see any actual evidence of anything here. Also he'll get in trouble for posting pictures in the lobby you'd think.

Aren't Whistleblowers protected ?

He can make a legitimate case that he needed to take the photo, to correctly identify the guilty parties, & make sure of his facts.

How are they doing this with an 80 odd seat majority? Every time I go away and check back the pack of incompetent morons have reached some new milestone.

_Os_ wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 8:14 pm How are they doing this with an 80 odd seat majority? Every time I go away and check back the pack of incompetent morons have reached some new milestone.

It's down to 69 as of yesterday, with the by-elections, suspensions, defections, etc, etc

Todays events could well lead to a few more defections, if nothing else

Charles Walker MP (com) absolutely losing it on BBC news. So angry he looked like he was going to cry.

“Hope those people that backed Truss so they could get to hold a red box and sit round the cabinet table are now happy”

“This is what happens when talentless people are promoted”

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 8:03 pm

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 7:34 pm Comments suggesting he has passed photos to the Dept Speaker.

JRM & Coffey should be suspended immediately

Looks like he has.

Hope that he has more to back up his claims though, as this shows nothing conclusive.

Slick wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 8:17 pm Charles Walker MP (com) absolutely losing it on BBC news. So angry he looked like he was going to cry.

“Hope those people that backed Truss so they could get to hold a red box and sit round the cabinet table are now happy”

“This is what happens when talentless people are promoted”

Apologies, thought I was watching it live

Meanwhile one loyal Tory MP says this is all Labour's doing in trying to destabilize the Government and take over Parliament....

No-one could make this shit up

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 8:13 pm

I like neeps wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 8:05 pm

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 8:03 pm


Looks like he has.

Very hard to see any actual evidence of anything here. Also he'll get in trouble for posting pictures in the lobby you'd think.

Aren't Whistleblowers protected ?

He can make a legitimate case that he needed to take the photo, to correctly identify the guilty parties, & make sure of his facts.

But he's not done that. It's a picture that shows Coffey and Rees-Mogg and some confused/mildly shocked Tories but nothing more.

I like neeps wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 8:32 pm

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 8:13 pm

I like neeps wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 8:05 pm

Very hard to see any actual evidence of anything here. Also he'll get in trouble for posting pictures in the lobby you'd think.

Aren't Whistleblowers protected ?

He can make a legitimate case that he needed to take the photo, to correctly identify the guilty parties, & make sure of his facts.

But he's not done that. It's a picture that shows Coffey and Rees-Mogg and some confused/mildly shocked Tories but nothing more.

His account has been corroborated by other MPs though, & this all happened contemporaneously, so it's not like he thought; "I'll just take a snap, so I make up a story about MPs being bullied to vote".

There's dozens of people in that pic, & there were hundreds of others going thru to vote, so the Speaker isn't going to have a hard time getting MPs to confirm or deny the story; & it's not like the last allegations of Whips going beyond the acceptable is in the dim & distant past.

And then we have the assessment of the now Ex Deputy Chief Whip

Reportedly the Chief Whip and Deputy have "unresigned"

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 7:47 pm

Was the word; Cunt, Krishnan ?

If so, it was certainly not, in any way, out of line, just understandable in the presence of such an odious, lying ball of intolerance & vileness.

I honestly didn't know that was what he'd actually called him when I posted this; so I'm obviously delighted that even someone as errudite, as Krishnan struggles to come up with anything else when faced with such a loathsome creature.

Even Dick and Dom are after them now

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 8:43 pm

I like neeps wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 8:32 pm

fishfoodie wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 8:13 pm

Aren't Whistleblowers protected ?

He can make a legitimate case that he needed to take the photo, to correctly identify the guilty parties, & make sure of his facts.

But he's not done that. It's a picture that shows Coffey and Rees-Mogg and some confused/mildly shocked Tories but nothing more.

His account has been corroborated by other MPs though, & this all happened contemporaneously, so it's not like he thought; "I'll just take a snap, so I make up a story about MPs being bullied to vote".

There's dozens of people in that pic, & there were hundreds of others going thru to vote, so the Speaker isn't going to have a hard time getting MPs to confirm or deny the story; & it's not like the last allegations of Whips going beyond the acceptable is in the dim & distant past.

And then we have the assessment of the now Ex Deputy Chief Whip

No 10 reporting they've both unresigned (as of 22:34).

I suppose that means that they'll both be in the HoL, after Dizzys Honours list at the end of the week ?

Back in the cabinet for two days and it’s already Jeremy Cunt again on broadcast TV

Biffer wrote: ↑Wed Oct 19, 2022 11:15 pm Back in the cabinet for two days and it’s already Jeremy Cunt again on broadcast TV

He did have Steve Baker in the studio with him to be fair .....

The whole structure of the Tory Party is breaking apart

40 Tory MPS failed to vote last night reportedly

More shambles this morning. Apparently no. 10 texted journalists last night to say the Fracking vote was a confidence vote and that those who failed to vote without a valid excuse will be disciplined.

This morning, the Transport Minister, Anne-Marie Trevelyan, has been lying through her teeth on the Breakfast shows, but when asked said it was an ‘important’ vote, but not a vote of confidence.

Given the reported anger amongst Tory back benchers, I can see any attempt by Truss to discipline members going down like the proverbial cup of cold sick.

EnergiseR2 wrote: ↑Thu Oct 20, 2022 6:24 am It's because they somehow think they can hold on. Tories were twats back say in the 90's but they fucked off when people wanted them to. Look at Queen twat Currie and her eggs. The new right like Johnson or across the water Trump just point blank refuse to go. They must have been impossible to parent

It's easy, ship them off to boarding school.

.....................

So, correct me if I'm wrong here, but last night was originally a confidence motion on the government which was whipped to ensure a victory.

Someone stood up in the commons and said it was not a confidence vote, which caused the chief whip and deputy chief whip to resign.

MPs were bullied and harassed into the division lobby of the government's choice, making MPs vote against the wishes of their constituents.

When the vote was "won", it was then spun as a confidence motion and the Chief Whip and Deputy were back in post (presumably strong-armed back in)

Would that be a fair summation of events?

edit - I missed Lobby's post.

So now it wasn't a confidence vote, again.

I wonder what it will have been by lunchtime?

I know Armando Iannucci stopped writing The Thick of It because life was imitating art, but even he would have struggled to make this believable comedy

You don't get rich betting against the Tory Party, but it's entirely feasible this is the end for them

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Thu Oct 20, 2022 7:38 am You don't get rich betting against the Tory Party, but it's entirely feasible this is the end for them

A lot of people across the country hold conservative views, I oppose them vehemently and think that they are wrong, but I also respect the fact that this is not in any way a minority view, especially in rural communities.

The Tories have abandoned their constituents, they've been taken over by the interests of hedge funds and Big Corp at the expense of the population, they deserve to wither and die as a party.

They won't, of course, they still have that 20% minimum who will vote for them no matter how inept or corrupt they are, they are nothing if not successful in winning elections, unfortunately I think rumours of their demise are somewhat exaggerated, etc

Tichtheid wrote: ↑Thu Oct 20, 2022 7:49 am

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Thu Oct 20, 2022 7:38 am You don't get rich betting against the Tory Party, but it's entirely feasible this is the end for them

A lot of people across the country hold conservative views, I oppose them vehemently and think that they are wrong, but I also respect the fact that this is not in any way a minority view, especially in rural communities.

The Tories have abandoned their constituents, they've been taken over by the interests of hedge funds and Big Corp at the expense of the population, they deserve to wither and die as a party.

They won't, of course, they still have that 20% minimum who will vote for them no matter how inept or corrupt they are, they are nothing if not successful in winning elections, unfortunately I think rumours of their demise are somewhat exaggerated, etc

They've fallen into the same trap that Labour did under Corbyn. The majority of their MPs are not vehemently right wing - as we saw during the election of Truss, who was 1st choice amongst a quite small minority of MPs - but they have become hostage to the ERG/Tufton group and the votes of the membership who appear easily fooled. In some ways it was encouraging to see how many of their MPs were appalled at the prospect of tax cuts for the rich while not raising benefits in line with inflation. Even BoJo wasn't really right wing, he was just a political opportunist who used Brexit to further his own ends.

Either way, they aren't going anywhere for a couple of years, regardless of the chaos in their ranks.

Today we get Braverman's resignation speech to the House.

I'm sure it will be in keeping with her personality.

Shirley at this point the opposition should try and get Truss to commit to NOT calling a GE, so she can U-turn 5 minutes later and accidentally call one

According to my local MP, Elections are never a waste of time or money, so presumably he'll have no objection to calling a GE

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-63317010

Tichtheid wrote: ↑Thu Oct 20, 2022 7:49 amA lot of people across the country hold conservative views, I oppose them vehemently and think that they are wrong, but I also respect the fact that this is not in any way a minority view, especially in rural communities.

The Tories have abandoned their constituents, they've been taken over by the interests of hedge funds and Big Corp at the expense of the population, they deserve to wither and die as a party.

I was thinking about this recently.

When I was a student I was a member (for a time) of the Conservative party. The party I grew up with in the 60s in Scotland could be described in retrospect as 'noblesse oblige' Tories. They were the party of the landed gentry and the aristocracy*, they viewed ruling as their birth right, and they were opposed to unions and other such communist trends. But they also viewed it as their duty to lead the country, not for their own betterment, but for the general good. Albeit in a paternalist 'chaps who went to private schools know best' way.

There was much that was wrong with them and their attitudes then, but their sense of duty to the country is the one thing that should have been preserved above all else, but is the thing that has most obviously gone missing.

Lots of stereotypes and simplifications in that. Plus a few generalisations.

* my family were neither landed gentry or aristocracy, though I did go to a private school. We were aspirational small business people.