NPR

C69 wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 9:12 pm

lemonhead wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 8:57 pm

Tichtheid wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 8:50 pm I chose not to watch because it's not real. Whatever happens the Toryshitegraph will say the ex-banker/hedgefund guy or whatever he was won the debate and the Guardian will say otherwise, the public opinion on it will be decided by the reach of the media and who they support.

The one thing I'm sure of is that we can all look back on the last 14 years and it would take some sort of liar to say that it's been a positive time for the UK.

Grauniad to be fair is the only paper I can recall that switched allegiances over the last 20 years in endorsing the next government. Also currently calling the 'debate' for Sunak btw.

It matters not a jot. Sunak was just making shit up and not being taken to task to he did it again and again fair play.
Starmer was too quiet, but it's very early days

sefton wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 6:05 pm

David in Gwent wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 4:15 pm

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 4:09 pm The escalation is not obvious.

2 MPs being murdered is awful and massively concerning, but when the perpetrators are a conspiracy-theory obsessed white supremacist and an ISIS enthusiast any link between their actions and random members of the public very occasionally tossing food or drink at a politician comes across as tenuous at best.

Incidents involving food or drink from the last 20 years are relevant insofar as they demonstrate how incredibly rarely they occur and that not a one of them inspired a spate of similar or worse in anything like an immediate time frame. We're on about one every few years. Like I said in another post, the politicians have greater odds of being hit by a bus.

Just be honest and not disingenuous, you don't mind politicians being assaulted as long as you don't like them.

Says the MAGA fan.

David in Gwent wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 9:18 pm

sefton wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 6:05 pm

David in Gwent wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 4:15 pm

Just be honest and not disingenuous, you don't mind politicians being assaulted as long as you don't like them.

Says the MAGA fan.

I support Trump over Biden, you'd have to be addicted to idiocy if you don't feel the same.

If only you could see that you're now part of the establishment that you once hated and fought against.

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 9:08 pm Dire stuff. Sunak is done, wonder how long it will take Labour to implode in government

C69 wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 9:25 pm

David in Gwent wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 9:18 pm

sefton wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 6:05 pm

Says the MAGA fan.

I support Trump over Biden, you'd have to be addicted to idiocy if you don't feel the same.

If only you could see that you're now part of the establishment that you once hated and fought against.

Lol please give us your analysis on Sefton.

Tichtheid wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 9:29 pm

C69 wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 9:25 pm

David in Gwent wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 9:18 pm

I support Trump over Biden, you'd have to be addicted to idiocy if you don't feel the same.

If only you could see that you're now part of the establishment that you once hated and fought against.

Lol please give us your analysis on Sefton.

He comes on here to attack the people on the bored rather than to make a positive point - fuck him, he's not worth the electrons it takes to post a message

Tichtheid wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 9:27 pm

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 9:08 pm Dire stuff. Sunak is done, wonder how long it will take Labour to implode in government

FFS, you surely can't want that?

No reasonable person would think there will be an opposition party fit to take over any time soon, the Tories are going to be decimated - would you want the worst of all cases Milk Shake Farage as PM?

Tichtheid wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 9:27 pm

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 9:08 pm Dire stuff. Sunak is done, wonder how long it will take Labour to implode in government

FFS, you surely can't want that?

No reasonable person would think there will be an opposition party fit to take over any time soon, the Tories are going to be decimated - would you want the worst of all cases Milk Shake Farage as PM?

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 9:32 pm

Tichtheid wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 9:27 pm

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 9:08 pm Dire stuff. Sunak is done, wonder how long it will take Labour to implode in government

FFS, you surely can't want that?

No reasonable person would think there will be an opposition party fit to take over any time soon, the Tories are going to be decimated - would you want the worst of all cases Milk Shake Farage as PM?

I didn’t say I want it, but I think it’s a viable thing that could happen. Starmer always underwhelms

C69 wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 9:32 pm

Tichtheid wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 9:27 pm

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 9:08 pm Dire stuff. Sunak is done, wonder how long it will take Labour to implode in government

FFS, you surely can't want that?

No reasonable person would think there will be an opposition party fit to take over any time soon, the Tories are going to be decimated - would you want the worst of all cases Milk Shake Farage as PM?

Tbh I have noticed a real change in Sefton since he moved to the seaside. The lovely nearby Parks and leafy tree lined Georgian and Victorian houses have made him soft and espousing middle class values

Tichtheid wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 9:36 pm

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 9:32 pm

Tichtheid wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 9:27 pm


FFS, you surely can't want that?

No reasonable person would think there will be an opposition party fit to take over any time soon, the Tories are going to be decimated - would you want the worst of all cases Milk Shake Farage as PM?

I didn’t say I want it, but I think it’s a viable thing that could happen. Starmer always underwhelms

You didn't say it explicitly, but forgive me I think your posting history is more sympathetic to the Tories than most here.

There is one choice at the next election for PM, Starmer or Sunak (I keep getting an autocorrect of Sunk for Sunak)
After that it's going to be some outlier like Truss back in charge for the Tories and the racist loons will go to Reform - that is your real world choice.

I would think you'd be better off hoping Starmer's government doesn't implode.

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 9:42 pm

Tichtheid wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 9:36 pm

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 9:32 pm

I didn’t say I want it, but I think it’s a viable thing that could happen. Starmer always underwhelms

You didn't say it explicitly, but forgive me I think your posting history is more sympathetic to the Tories than most here.

There is one choice at the next election for PM, Starmer or Sunak (I keep getting an autocorrect of Sunk for Sunak)
After that it's going to be some outlier like Truss back in charge for the Tories and the racist loons will go to Reform - that is your real world choice.

I would think you'd be better off hoping Starmer's government doesn't implode.

Being on the centre right (and explicitly wanting this government out) and wanting a PM Farage are very different things.

Tichtheid wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 9:48 pm

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 9:42 pm

Tichtheid wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 9:36 pm


You didn't say it explicitly, but forgive me I think your posting history is more sympathetic to the Tories than most here.

There is one choice at the next election for PM, Starmer or Sunak (I keep getting an autocorrect of Sunk for Sunak)
After that it's going to be some outlier like Truss back in charge for the Tories and the racist loons will go to Reform - that is your real world choice.

I would think you'd be better off hoping Starmer's government doesn't implode.

Being on the centre right (and explicitly wanting this government out) and wanting a PM Farage are very different things.

They might be different things, but I was talking about the reality of what will be on offer over the course of the next parliament.

If you're hoping for Starmer to fail, well, just be careful what you wish for.

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 9:49 pm

Tichtheid wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 9:48 pm

Paddington Bear wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 9:42 pm

Being on the centre right (and explicitly wanting this government out) and wanting a PM Farage are very different things.

They might be different things, but I was talking about the reality of what will be on offer over the course of the next parliament.

If you're hoping for Starmer to fail, well, just be careful what you wish for.

At no point have I said I hope he fails. I think he’ll fail, that’s different

_Os_ wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 10:28 pm A half hour interview with each, conducted by someone who actually tries to examine what their plans are, no studio audience. Would've been much better.

"You have 45 seconds to explain your entire policy on NHS/climate change/immigration" didn't work. On second thoughts, Sunak's strategy of just repeating the same soundbite maybe was the better choice, weird because it was robotic and he didn't land anything on Starmer. But he also managed to repeat "Labour will raise taxes" so often, maybe that's all anyone remembers. The format was aiming more at being an entertainment product, maybe Sunak's Tik Tok length nonsense is the way to go.

Very odd, not sure what to make of it at all. "You have talked for longer than 30 seconds on climate change, that's enough".

Insane_Homer wrote: ↑Wed Jun 05, 2024 7:48 am sunak_lies.jpg

SaintK wrote: ↑Wed Jun 05, 2024 7:27 am An uninspiring no score draw!!!!

Slick wrote: ↑Wed Jun 05, 2024 7:55 am

Insane_Homer wrote: ↑Wed Jun 05, 2024 7:48 am sunak_lies.jpg

I don't know why that is real or not, but I can't get my head around why it took Starmer until about the 10th time it had been mentioned to make a defence, and really meekly at that. Even after he had pointed out it was bollocks he let Sunak say it again and again. Maybe it was nerves, but it was a massive own goal.

C T wrote: ↑Wed Jun 05, 2024 8:29 am

Slick wrote: ↑Wed Jun 05, 2024 7:55 am

Insane_Homer wrote: ↑Wed Jun 05, 2024 7:48 am sunak_lies.jpg

I don't know why that is real or not, but I can't get my head around why it took Starmer until about the 10th time it had been mentioned to make a defence, and really meekly at that. Even after he had pointed out it was bollocks he let Sunak say it again and again. Maybe it was nerves, but it was a massive own goal.

For full disclosure, I really want this Tory government out. Further to this I personally tend to lean more to the left than the right. So I am probably biased against Sunak.

That said, just at the weekend I was saying to a friend that I feel a bit sorry for Sunak. He's been left with this rotten, stinking, rank version of the Tory party. I also think that a massive Labour landslide kind of defeats the point. You're supposed to have strong parties challenging each other/working together.

Anyway, Starmer definitely should have way more firmly and quickly dealt with this £2'000 per person claim.

It is bothering me though that it appears to be the only thing I've heard on the media since the debate. Admittedly I've just been over-hearing rather than sat watching various news outlets. But heard nothing on Sunak saying he'd use private medical care. His petulant attitude appears to be being sold as back to the wall fighting. The laughs when discussions his NHS waiting list reduction claim, and the National Service chuckle.

What is definitely getting stuffed down my throat though is the Starmer £2'000 thing. It wasn't great, at all, but feels like the Tory media machine is at it again.

To court working class voters, Starmer touts his background as the son of a factory floor toolmaker. But peek behind the veil and cracks emerge in this narrative. Turns out his father owned an independent toolmaking firm, devoid of managers lording over factory workers. Already Starmer’s tale feels more scripted than authentic.

During his speech at the TUC, Keir Starmer recounted an anecdote about his father, a skilled toolmaker who allegedly felt looked down upon for working on the factory floor.

During a speech at the TUC, Starmer claimed:

“Despite being a skilled toolmaker throughout his working life, my dad thought people looked down on him because he worked on the factory floor. He was right about that

C T wrote: ↑Wed Jun 05, 2024 8:29 am

Slick wrote: ↑Wed Jun 05, 2024 7:55 am

Insane_Homer wrote: ↑Wed Jun 05, 2024 7:48 am sunak_lies.jpg

I don't know why that is real or not, but I can't get my head around why it took Starmer until about the 10th time it had been mentioned to make a defence, and really meekly at that. Even after he had pointed out it was bollocks he let Sunak say it again and again. Maybe it was nerves, but it was a massive own goal.

I also think that a massive Labour landslide kind of defeats the point. You're supposed to have strong parties challenging each other/working together.

David in Gwent wrote: ↑Wed Jun 05, 2024 9:02 am Starmer and his preposterous claim that his dad was a toolmaker still makes me laugh.

To court working class voters, Starmer touts his background as the son of a factory floor toolmaker. But peek behind the veil and cracks emerge in this narrative. Turns out his father owned an independent toolmaking firm, devoid of managers lording over factory workers. Already Starmer’s tale feels more scripted than authentic.

During his speech at the TUC, Keir Starmer recounted an anecdote about his father, a skilled toolmaker who allegedly felt looked down upon for working on the factory floor.

During a speech at the TUC, Starmer claimed:

“Despite being a skilled toolmaker throughout his working life, my dad thought people looked down on him because he worked on the factory floor. He was right about that

Starmer is a liar and the thought of him leading the country is quite frankly terrifying.

David in Gwent wrote: ↑Wed Jun 05, 2024 9:02 am the thought of him leading the country is quite frankly terrifying.

David in Gwent wrote: ↑Wed Jun 05, 2024 9:02 am Starmer and his preposterous claim that his dad was a toolmaker still makes me laugh.

To court working class voters, Starmer touts his background as the son of a factory floor toolmaker. But peek behind the veil and cracks emerge in this narrative. Turns out his father owned an independent toolmaking firm, devoid of managers lording over factory workers. Already Starmer’s tale feels more scripted than authentic.

During his speech at the TUC, Keir Starmer recounted an anecdote about his father, a skilled toolmaker who allegedly felt looked down upon for working on the factory floor.

During a speech at the TUC, Starmer claimed:

“Despite being a skilled toolmaker throughout his working life, my dad thought people looked down on him because he worked on the factory floor. He was right about that

Starmer is a liar and the thought of him leading the country is quite frankly terrifying.

Insane_Homer wrote: ↑Wed Jun 05, 2024 9:54 am

David in Gwent wrote: ↑Wed Jun 05, 2024 9:02 am the thought of him leading the country is quite frankly terrifying.

Snowflake

SaintK wrote: ↑Wed Jun 05, 2024 10:03 am

Insane_Homer wrote: ↑Wed Jun 05, 2024 9:54 am

David in Gwent wrote: ↑Wed Jun 05, 2024 9:02 am the thought of him leading the country is quite frankly terrifying.

Snowflake

You are far too kind. He's a complete and utter cunt.

S/Lt_Phillips wrote: ↑Wed Jun 05, 2024 10:00 am

David in Gwent wrote: ↑Wed Jun 05, 2024 9:02 am Starmer and his preposterous claim that his dad was a toolmaker still makes me laugh.

To court working class voters, Starmer touts his background as the son of a factory floor toolmaker. But peek behind the veil and cracks emerge in this narrative. Turns out his father owned an independent toolmaking firm, devoid of managers lording over factory workers. Already Starmer’s tale feels more scripted than authentic.

During his speech at the TUC, Keir Starmer recounted an anecdote about his father, a skilled toolmaker who allegedly felt looked down upon for working on the factory floor.

During a speech at the TUC, Starmer claimed:

“Despite being a skilled toolmaker throughout his working life, my dad thought people looked down on him because he worked on the factory floor. He was right about that

Starmer is a liar and the thought of him leading the country is quite frankly terrifying.

Hardly preposterous, his father was a toolmaker, who went on to run a business. But you know that.

However, your screaming hypocrisy comes to the fore again. You claim that Starmer's 'lie' makes it terrifying to consider him as PM, yet you're a massive cheerleader for proven liars Trump and Boris and Sunak. Tip: trolling works better if you're slightly credible.

The proposals of Keir Starmer’s ‘A New Britain‘ constitution, written up by Gordon Brown, are designed to destroy Parliament forever – and by extension anything approaching popular sovereignty in Britain. These are: the subordination of Parliament to the judiciary; universal English devolution; the reorganisation of Britain as a multi-national state; and the enshrining of the current social order as a constitution.

‘A New Britain’ will close off any route to democratic change. Blairite society, threatened by new adversaries, and, still more, by new technologies for sharing information, seeks to preserve its waning powers by transforming the U.K. into an ungovernable, ramshackle outfit on the pattern of late Poland-Lithuania or the Holy Roman Empire. A series of legal devices will be cooked up to prevent any change from our trajectory towards mediocrity and impoverishment.

David in Gwent wrote: ↑Wed Jun 05, 2024 10:19 am https://dailysceptic.org/2023/07/04/lab ... democracy/

The Daily Sceptic is a blog created by British commentator Toby Young

sockwithaticket wrote: ↑Wed Jun 05, 2024 10:29 am

Any writer putting together a character like DAC would be told to tone it down a bit for the sake of credibility. What an utter loon.

Insane_Homer wrote: ↑Wed Jun 05, 2024 10:34 am

David in Gwent wrote: ↑Wed Jun 05, 2024 10:19 am https://dailysceptic.org/2023/07/04/lab ... democracy/

The Daily Sceptic is a blog created by British commentator Toby Young