Tri Nations Test Argentina v NZ ‘Nero Fiddles’ thread.

[Gumboot]

Maybe they are trying to turn both Goodhue and ALB into utility kids who can play both positions as required? If so, I don’t like it much. Goodhue at 13 for me.

Yeah I always thought that, but not actually convinced he's got speed at 13. I always had ALB as a 12, my son always reckoned he a 13, and he has been good there, I tend to think a lot of us want him at 12 just so we can have Goodhue at 13.

I think you and your son are both right, but then I'm biased coz I want ALB starting every test. If the 12 Goodhue/13 ALB combo continues to malfunction, then change is needed at 12. Goodhue is a very good player, but he has to step up more consistently imho.

[Kiwias]

Am i the only one who thinks Brad Webber is a tad unlucky, the other two really haven't been playing that well

I agree. TJ especially has been poor. But is Brad Weber the future? Would have been good to see the grooming of a youngster...

I'd be more than happy with Folau Fakatava at no.21 tomorrow.

I've been mightily impressed with his play in the Mitre 10 and reckon he has earned a chance at the big boys' table. Just do something about that ludicrous hair style.

[Gumboot]

I agree. TJ especially has been poor. But is Brad Weber the future? Would have been good to see the grooming of a youngster...

I'd be more than happy with Folau Fakatava at no.21 tomorrow.

I've been mightily impressed with his play in the Mitre 10 and reckon he has earned a chance at the big boys' table. Just do something about that ludicrous hair style.

As long as he keeps playing this well I don't care if he sports a feckin' B52.

[Dan54]

Plus, come on. Wayne Smith wouldn’t say otherwise.

However you may have forgotten what Henry thought when speaking honestly.

Either way, it’s a dull argument to say only certain people are allowed to give opinion and all others don’t qualify.

It doesn’t take a head coach to be able to read the score board after 80 minutes. Nor does it take an expert to note so many players playing out of their best position, seemingly to shoehorn in players.

You mean Henry who was one of the ones who appointed him? Everyone has an opinion, and certainly entitled to them, just the idea that suddenly it bad to shoehorn players in when it been done for so bloody long just shows how little time some have watched rugby.

WUT

Mate I been watching rugby for a lot of years, and have seen players shoehorned into positions for most of that time, and heard 'experts' in pubs and my house etc going crook about it for as long!

[Ted.]

Fox was a selector for the entire 2015-2019 RWC cycle where we had an extremely poor selection record, and chopped and changed for changes sake. If he was against this policy but kept agreeing with it then he should have resigned years ago.

I’m repeating myself here, sorry... but I think it’s time for a complete independent review of all NZR operations and appointments.

But who will instigate that? NZRU won't ask for an independent review of their own practices...

They have previously. At least on the surface of it.

[Ymx]

Plus, come on. Wayne Smith wouldn’t say otherwise.

However you may have forgotten what Henry thought when speaking honestly.

Either way, it’s a dull argument to say only certain people are allowed to give opinion and all others don’t qualify.

It doesn’t take a head coach to be able to read the score board after 80 minutes. Nor does it take an expert to note so many players playing out of their best position, seemingly to shoehorn in players.

You mean Henry who was one of the ones who appointed him? Everyone has an opinion, and certainly entitled to them, just the idea that suddenly it bad to shoehorn players in when it been done for so bloody long just shows how little time some have watched rugby.

Dan I am. (What is your issue with Being Verbs is/am/has, btw?)

Henry the one who said the process was a mess and should have been more to choose from. Which pretty blatantly tells you he’s not happy with the result.

Henry who pretty much said it should have been Rennie.

Henry the one who said the castle needs to be knocked down and rebuilt.

Henry the one who said it will be Razor, when not if.

Reading between these not so thinly veiled points, had been fairly clear it should have been Rennie followed by Razor.

Henry suggested complacency was the ABs worst enemy and that losing to England was a good thing. No, he was wrong on this occasion. Foster is the ABs worst enemy it would seem.

As for shoe-horning. Never can I recall a level as bad as it is now. Not only that, there seems to be no learning process. Here we are still with Jordie on the wing. Centres wrong way around. Back row in a complete jumble.

[Ymx]

Thoughts? If Argentina win again. Could this be the last of Fozzy?

[stemoc]

Thoughts? If Argentina win again. Could this be the last of Fozzy?

yes, there is a limit but that said, Argentina has named a weak team too... NZ will win this

[Monkey Magic]

Thoughts? If Argentina win again. Could this be the last of Fozzy?

Blame covid for stuffing up all his planning, Argentina were fresh etc... can't see NZR saying they were wrong.

Lose the bled and/or rugby championship next year then could be changed for eoyt (assuming all those games happen)

[Jimmy Smallsteps]

Thoughts? If Argentina win again. Could this be the last of Fozzy?

Blame covid for stuffing up all his planning, Argentina were fresh etc... can't see NZR saying they were wrong.

Lose the bled and/or rugby championship next year then could be changed for eoyt (assuming all those games happen)

Yeah NZR will talk down their nose at us punters when Blind Freddy can see they are a bunch of amateurs playing make believe at being pros.

[Sandstorm]

Thoughts? If Argentina win again. Could this be the last of Fozzy?

End of Spiritual Guardians too surely?

[handyman]

Thoughts? If Argentina win again. Could this be the last of Fozzy?

Contract running until April 2022? Surely he only needs time in the seat to rectify the situation.

[Sandstorm]

[Jb1981]

It could have been worse.

Spoiler

Show

[Guy Smiley]

It could have been worse.

Spoiler

Show

Oooh...

Person with no current rugby relevance puts foot in ring. Then shoots foot.

[Sandstorm]

Can't happen this weekend. No foreign refs in SA.

[Jimmy Smallsteps]

Dear oh dear.

How restless are the fans of the international team formerly known as the Springboks?

[Sandstorm]

Dear oh dear.

How restless are the fans of the international team formerly known as the Springboks?

Medium-rare. We're enjoying both the watered-down RC and our local contests in 2020.

[Torquemada 1420]

[Ata Rangi]

It could have been worse.

Spoiler

Show

Oooh...

Person with no current rugby relevance puts foot in ring. Then shoots foot.

yeah, that was quite the week in SA. I was at both games but assaulted nothing more than an obscene amount of food and I certainly wasn’t throwing away my red wine.

Australia's coach Eddie Jones and captain George Gregan said they were appalled that bottles and oranges were thrown in the direction of Wallaby players celebrating a late try during the game at Ellis Park.

"There were three or four half full bottles that were thrown at us but fortunately nobody was hit," said Gregan.

"There were no more bottles thrown when we got back to the halfway line, but if there had been I would have taken the team off the field."

The incident comes in the wake of the assault on Irish referee David McHugh by a home fan during last week's match between the Springboks and New Zealand in Durban.

"It's absolutely disgraceful and Ellis Park has to have a look at themselves," Jones said.

"I can't believe they allow bottled beer in the stands, it's absolutely ridiculous and should be banned - it's quite simple."

[Sandstorm]

Our scum stood up to be counted two weeks in a row. You don't get that level of consistency and guts from the ABs.

[Jimmy Smallsteps]

Our scum stood up to be counted two weeks in a row. You don't get that level of consistency and guts from the ABs.

Yes, to be fair that is a lot more than the lineout, backline, reserves, coaching staff and the rest of the travelling staff have managed in 2020.

Well put.

[Torquemada 1420]

Our scum stood up to be counted two weeks in a row. You don't get that level of consistency and guts from the ABs.

[JM2K6]

Our scum stood up to be counted two weeks in a row. You don't get that level of consistency and guts from the ABs.

It's not a typo. He's talking about the fans.

[Jimmy Smallsteps]

Our scum stood up to be counted two weeks in a row. You don't get that level of consistency and guts from the ABs.

It's not a typo. He's talking about the fans.

Don't be ridiculous. Since when have Jaapie fans stood up for anything.

[Torquemada 1420]

With Chocolate-bars out of the centres and Imhoff injured, this is now adv NZ. Spiritual Guardians to resurrect, win by 10 and secure Foster's tenure until after then next RWC after which they will crucify him.

[Dan54]

[

As for shoe-horning. Never can I recall a level as bad as it is now. Not only that, there seems to be no learning process. Here we are still with Jordie on the wing. Centres wrong way around. Back row in a complete jumble.
[/quote]
Mate it great opinion, but that's all it is an opinion about which way around the centres should be. Razor played Goodhue at 12 so even he either agrees that his best place or he shoehorning players in out of position which you are going crook about. I always a Goodhue fan , but as said I not sure he quick fast enough for 13, but like yours that just my opinion. Conrad Smith was also not that fast for a 13, but his brain was so good he made up for it I thought.
As for shoehorning mate, not sure how old you are, but can assure you it no more now than it ever was , even in the 70s I remember the ABs picking players out of position to fit them in team, just in those days there was no internet boreds for 'experts 'to vent !

[Torquemada 1420]

BBC reporting at its finest:

Crusaders coach Scott Robertson is a man who makes new traditions instead. The 46-year-old celebrates titles with on-pitch breakdancing.

And he has got plenty of practice. His whirling limbs have now circled four straight Super Rugby titles, having turned the Canterbury side from under-achievers to serial winners.

[Gumboot]

As for shoehorning mate, not sure how old you are, but can assure you it no more now than it ever was , even in the 70s I remember the ABs picking players out of position to fit them in team, just in those days there was no internet boreds for 'experts 'to vent !

I'm not so sure about that. With the odd exception - Duncan Robertson at fullback in SA - I don't recall shoehorning happening in the 70s to anywhere near the extent it does these days. Can't recall an openside ever being selected at no.8 for example. The players were generally chosen in their best positions iirc.

But it's a while ago, so happy to be corrected.

[JM2K6]

BBC reporting at its finest:

Crusaders coach Scott Robertson is a man who makes new traditions instead. The 46-year-old celebrates titles with on-pitch breakdancing.

And he has got plenty of practice. His whirling limbs have now circled four straight Super Rugby titles, having turned the Canterbury side from under-achievers to serial winners.

That's pretty good by the BBC. Crusaders under Robertson: 1st 1st 1st

Crusaders in the previous 5 years: 7th, 7th, 2nd, 4th, 4th

They hadn't won SR since the Super 14 days!

[Gumboot]

BBC reporting at its finest:

Crusaders coach Scott Robertson is a man who makes new traditions instead. The 46-year-old celebrates titles with on-pitch breakdancing.

And he has got plenty of practice. His whirling limbs have now circled four straight Super Rugby titles, having turned the Canterbury side from under-achievers to serial winners.

That's pretty good by the BBC. Crusaders under Robertson: 1st 1st 1st

Crusaders in the previous 5 years: 7th, 7th, 2nd, 4th, 4th

They hadn't won SR since the Super 14 days!

Yeah, but the BBC's referring to Canterbury, not the Crusaders. Canterbury has won 7 of the last 11 National Provincial titles.

[Guy Smiley]

Nah, I think ‘the Canterbury side’ fits with the earlier reference to ‘Crusaders’ coach’...

and they did underachieve, Torq.

Bringing Razor into the conversation now though, that’s just cruel and unjust.

[Gumboot]

Nah, I think ‘the Canterbury side’ fits with the earlier reference to ‘Crusaders’ coach’...

and they did underachieve, Torq.

Bringing Razor into the conversation now though, that’s just cruel and unjust.

Fair enough, it could certainly be interpreted that way.

[JM2K6]

Aye, "the Canterbury side" just means "the side from Canterbury" in that context.

[JPNZ]

Regardless of all the coaching mess, now it’s the players time to turn up. They won’t want to be stewing all summer on a loss. The ABs will win this by quite a margin tonight. 14+ here 1st

[obelixtim]

Regardless of all the coaching mess, now it’s the players time to turn up. They won’t want to be stewing all summer on a loss. The ABs will win this by quite a margin tonight. 14+ here 1st

Actually, at the moment, I get the feeling that a lot of moron fans don't give a shit, either way. What with Canes outburst, and Fozzies ineptitude, interest in the ABs is slowly slipping down the pan.

Another loss will see it slip around the U bend.

[Dan54]

As for shoehorning mate, not sure how old you are, but can assure you it no more now than it ever was , even in the 70s I remember the ABs picking players out of position to fit them in team, just in those days there was no internet boreds for 'experts 'to vent !

I'm not so sure about that. With the odd exception - Duncan Robertson at fullback in SA - I don't recall shoehorning happening in the 70s to anywhere near the extent it does these days. Can't recall an openside ever being selected at no.8 for example. The players were generally chosen in their best positions iirc.

But it's a while ago, so happy to be corrected.

You obviously don't remember one Stack Stevens from Wellington being picked for whole tour as a 10 when he played 9 for Wellington, I seem to recall one game in France where there were 3 halfbacks on field with Sid Going at 15 , though it was just a mid week game. We also had one BJ Lochore playing a test against Lions at lock, he was never anything but an 8, he had actually retired if memory serves me correctly, and got bought back in to play lock as they wanted his leadership , and someone was conveniently injured. But players like Mike Gibson, probably one of best 13s I seen play was a 10 who went to 13 for Lions and I think actually ended up playing 10,12 and 13 for Ireland, though I am happy to be corrected, but I can't be arsed looking for info. Ian McCrae even in the 60s was a centre who got moved to 12 (2nd 5/8) to fit in with Bill Davis etc. I sure there were quite a few , it wasn't really that unusual. Hell Grizz Wylie and Alan Sutherland were 8s who played on flank when needed and to fit them in teams, Gary sear played lock or 8. I not saying it good or bad, just nothing new.

[Carter's Choice]

Dan 54, do you ever tire of making excuses for Ian Foster and NZR?

[Gumboot]

As for shoehorning mate, not sure how old you are, but can assure you it no more now than it ever was , even in the 70s I remember the ABs picking players out of position to fit them in team, just in those days there was no internet boreds for 'experts 'to vent !

I'm not so sure about that. With the odd exception - Duncan Robertson at fullback in SA - I don't recall shoehorning happening in the 70s to anywhere near the extent it does these days. Can't recall an openside ever being selected at no.8 for example. The players were generally chosen in their best positions iirc.

But it's a while ago, so happy to be corrected.

You obviously don't remember one Stack Stevens from Wellington being picked for whole tour as a 10 when he played 9 for Wellington, I seem to recall one game in France where there were 3 halfbacks on field with Sid Going at 15 , though it was just a mid week game. We also had one BJ Lochore playing a test against Lions at lock, he was never anything but an 8, he had actually retired if memory serves me correctly, and got bought back in to play lock as they wanted his leadership , and someone was conveniently injured. But players like Mike Gibson, probably one of best 13s I seen play was a 10 who went to 13 for Lions and I think actually ended up playing 10,12 and 13 for Ireland, though I am happy to be corrected, but I can't be arsed looking for info. Ian McCrae even in the 60s was a centre who got moved to 12 (2nd 5/8) to fit in with Bill Davis etc. I sure there were quite a few , it wasn't really that unusual. Hell Grizz Wylie and Alan Sutherland were 8s who played on flank when needed and to fit them in teams, Gary sear played lock or 8. I not saying it good or bad, just nothing new.

Do you mean Ian "Nectar" Stevens? If so, I vaguely remember him as a very good halfback with a great pass, but wasn't he also a more than useful first five before he made the ABs?

As for the loosies like Grizz and Sutherland - I don't really remember much about them. Was a bit too young then, and only started getting seriously interested in the All Blacks when I started secondary school in 1974. Pretty sure the test selections weren't that ropey for the rest of that decade...with the odd exception, of course. Certainly nothing like today's continual pick n' mix approach.

[Guy Smiley]

Dan54, have you ever considered using a bit of punctuation and the odd paragraph? Just to slow down the breathy rush of your posts... reading them makes me feel like I’m stuck in an office dunny trying to enjoy a healthy morning crap on a timer with a loud alarm.